Re bad body language/Jacca

I actually couldn't care less if he looks a bit scared in the vids!

Why? This dog has multiple bite history (including hospitial treatment) severe resource guarding aggresison and dog aggression. Or rather had!

He was due to be pts 2 hours after I picked him up!

Considering he'd had these problems his whole life and had trainer/behaviourists involved who had all taken a softly softly approach I really am not interested in weather the initial training was fun or any of that crap for him.

Fact is this is a dog 99% of people had written off and no one would touch. If I had to upset him a few times to turn his behaviour round I'm fine with it.

Adam

Oh dear, it's the fact that you don't care what his body language is telling you in that clip that is seriously worrying, Adam.

It's a shame that Patch isn't still around. If you want to know how kinder methods work with a dog that is extremely dog aggressive, she could write a book. Similar circumstances, but, if memory serves, no one could get near the cage the dog was in, let alone go near him. She turned him round, Adam. She didn't zap, pinch, choke. She just used patience and understanding - it worked.

I thought this thread was about prong collars?
Only `adam` has boasted of using electric shocks on this dog to force him into subservience, so I don`t quite see that his posts are on topic.

Woo hoo - we have the truth. You do not care for the dog - you care for the results.

Now HOW long has it taken for you to admit what we have known all along!!

Yeah we kind of got off topic didn't we lol. & what a heated debate it was! Oh we'll, that's the nature of human conversation I suppose.

Not in the way you mean. They'd trained the dog to be too worried to do anything, yes.

Wys
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I miss Patch, she was fab and very knowledgeable with very aggressive dogs.



Wys
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Ya know Adam, I can never tell if you believe this or if you've been so indoctrinated by certain people that you just cannot see the real truth.

You keep repeating this (let's be kind and call it an "inaccuracy" or "incorrect statement") on both this and other forums.

It's NOT operant conditioning and it's not any kind of science, it is made up so that lies can be told about people who choose to train with rewards (i.e so that supporters of aversive methods can say "oh look, they say they are trainig with rewards but actually they are using negative methods, their dogs are stressed, etc).

And no it's not in Skinner - this is exactly the point, it's not anywhere scientific

If you can prove your assertions are correct, please do so with links to the scientific proof - otherwise please accept that you are wrong and do not continue to push this lie about

I can tell you what my dog experiences when she's waiting for a reward - excitement, anticipation, satisfaction, and other associated emotions.

Wys
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Absolutely, totally agree - training is pleasantly and excitedly anticipated which is also fun and stress free for the owner! Love it

Agree...

Yes, sadly - and this is why people who are against such devices will continue to fight against their use until they are banned.

Simples, as the meerkat says .

Wys
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Waits with baited breath

I've only seen three people push forward with the misinformed, misguided and downright incorrect definitions that Adam has put forward on here. One a very strange American gentleman (who I suspect started the ball rolling), the other a very strange (to say the least) English fella and the third, Adam himself. The wording used is basically identical and the same twisting, turning, avoidance and illogical reasoning used when asking for evidence to back up the claims.

You can claim black is white until the cows come home, but it really does not make it true and just tends to make those who insist it is look rather silly