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Paddywack
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02-08-2008, 03:04 PM
Originally Posted by Jackbox View Post
Oh well if it is in the "SUN" it must be true,
Nope it's the telegraph actually only comment from the sun was:
"According to The Sun, the dogs will be trained to accompany soldiers on what are called 'High Altitude High Opening' parachute jumps, after which they may have to travel 20 miles to their targets."
According to the Telegraph

"It is thought the German Shepherds are being taught to jump from aircraft at 25,000ft, strapped to members of special forces assault teams.

With tiny cameras fixed to their heads, the animals will be sent in before their human partners to hunt for Taliban or insurgent hideouts.

The cameras will beam live images back to the troops as the dogs penetrate behind enemy lines and warn of ambushes.

An SAS source told the newspaper: "The dogs will be exposed to very high levels of danger on these operations and you never know what's going to be behind a door. Nobody wants to see the dogs get killed but if it's their life or a man's it is obvious which the CO would prefer."

The elite American unit, 1st Special Forces Operational Detachment-Delta, commonly known as Delta Force, has pioneered the parachute technique from heights over 20,000ft and its instructors have reportedly been sent over to 22 SAS headquarters in Hereford.

The Ministry of Defence refused to comment.

Dogs were first trained to parachute in the Second World War but have never before jumped from such high altitudes. "
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Shona
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02-08-2008, 03:08 PM
I think the article is rather vague,, I honestly dont think the dogs will be working that far ahead of there handlers tbh,
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Jackie
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02-08-2008, 03:08 PM
Originally Posted by Paddywack View Post
They have the choice to join the army. Anyone joining the army obviously has to accept that they could be called upon to fight in a war zone. How long has this war been going on now, if they don't want to fight in Iraq don't join the army, simple. Yes I respect them but I don't for one minute believe they don't have a choice, they made that choice.
People have a choice to join the forces ofcause they do...but if everyone of our armed forces sat down and pondered over the wheres and why`s they are going to be dispatched to, where would we be, we need our arm forces , and they deserve respect, not a flyaway comment on ...having a choice or not.

If one dog saves one young mans life at the loss of its own.... then I am sorry, I am behind it 100%.

The story above if true, is not as simple as throwing dogs the loins.. to be used for target practice... they will be there working with their handlers... doing a vital job, and hopefully keeping dogs and humans safe.

Dogs have been used in times of war going back to WW1 , probably even before... they do their job, they save lives.
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JoedeeUK
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02-08-2008, 03:11 PM
Originally Posted by ClaireandDaisy View Post
There was an article in the Sun showing dogs being trained to parachute with their handlers (a bit like the abseiling policeman & dog on Send in the Dogs`) in preparation for being used on active service and this seems to have been picked up by a vet in India as `dogs being used a target fodder by the Taliban`.
I really don`t think these petitions do much good - I see they are signed by people all over the world, so I can`t imagine our Gvt. being worried about its share of the vote TBH. Also, the petition is worded in such a way that is makes huge assumptions about what is apparently planned - which I for one don`t believe because it just doesn`t make sense.
If you don`t agree with war - or with the Iraq war - that`s one thing. Petitioning against the use of dogs in the Forces is a different matter. I don`t see that the use of sniifer dogs, tracking dogs, guarding dogs -all taking the smae risks as their handlers - is a bad thing.
Dogs are trained to be lowered from helicopters & to be parachuted into a location with their handlers not on their own.

Yes dogs have lost their lives protecting their handlers abroad & in the UK-a lovely GSD Met bitch protected her handler from a bomb in London & died from her wounds, but she saved her handlers life & I know that she was adored by him just as she adored him.

Dogs have always been used in warfare going back to the invasion of England by the Romans & further back still. The difference now is that the dogs are highly trained & highly valued rather than being cannon fodder. Boudica & the Iceni had "dogs of war"
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Paddywack
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02-08-2008, 03:11 PM
Originally Posted by Jackbox View Post
Dogs have been used in times of war going back to WW1 , probably even before... they do their job, they save lives.
Doesn't make it right. Like I said humans have the choice, dogs don't. Who the hell do we think we are to force another species to take a bullet for us. Many may disagree which I accept. However what I don't accept is people agreeing with putting dogs in a position knowing dam well those dogs will automatically lose their lives not just risking their lives.
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Shona
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02-08-2008, 03:17 PM
I dont think the sas will want these dogs to be seen {if poss} it would only serve to warn the taliban that an attack is imminent, as they say fore warned is fore armed, not really in the sas's best interest,,
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Jackie
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02-08-2008, 03:18 PM
Originally Posted by Paddywack View Post
Nope it's the telegraph actually only comment from the sun was:


According to the Telegraph
Originally Posted by Paddywack View Post
Doesn't make it right. Like I said humans have the choice, dogs don't. Who the hell do we think we are to force another species to take a bullet for us. Many may disagree which I accept. However what I don't accept is people agreeing with puting dogs in a postion knowing dam well those dogs will lose their lives not just risking their lives.
Ok, so would you class a sniffer dog on the London underground in the same capacity... would you be happy to see a train/bus/blown up, people being maimed and killed, rather than seeing a dog use its nose to do the excellent job it does... and the slight risk of it loosing its life in the process.
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Paddywack
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02-08-2008, 03:18 PM
I do hope you're right Shona
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Paddywack
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02-08-2008, 03:19 PM
Originally Posted by Jackbox View Post
Ok, so would you class a sniffer dog on the London underground in the same capacity... would you be happy to see a train/bus/blown up, people being maimed and killed, rather than seeing a dog use its nose to do the excellent job it does... and the slight risk of it loosing its life in the process.
How many sniffer dogs do you know that have had their noses blown off?
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Helena54
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02-08-2008, 03:20 PM
Originally Posted by Paddywack View Post
They have the choice to join the army. Anyone joining the army obviously has to accept that they could be called upon to fight in a war zone. How long has this war been going on now, if they don't want to fight in Iraq don't join the army, simple. Yes I respect them but I don't for one minute believe they don't have a choice, they made that choice.
Yeah, I was just about to say that??? Why do they join the army, for free bed and breakfast then??? I think not! They join the army because they want to be where the action is, they just love it! I've seen the interviews done on those big tough guys, they always say, bring it on!!! You don't go and sign up with the army coz you "want to see the World", not nowadays, those days have long gone. YES, my brother was in the Para's for 30 years, he fought, he did the lot, and I admire him for it, just like I do all our boys who are out there now.

I still say, leave the dogs out of it! They didn't sign themselves up, WE put them at risk. Leave them to do GOOD jobs over here, over anywhere, put them to good work, not where they don't stand a chance.

You may have your boys over there Shona, I know friends who also have their own boys over there, nobody's saying they don't do a brilliant job, even I said they do a fantastic job, nobody's slating them, we're only giving our opinions as to whether they should send in the dogs, and mine is no!
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