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Hali
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11-11-2009, 10:03 AM
Originally Posted by Jackbox View Post
It was on the news yestaday!!!!!!!!
Are you sure that they said that the protocol was for a hand written letter? I know the protocol is for the commanding offier to do a hand written letter and that the PM is to write...but I've seen nothing that says that the PM is to do a hand written letter (nor anything to say that any other PM has ever done a hand written letter).

I think its one of those things...damned if he does, damned if he doesn't. To my mind by hand writing that letter he was trying to show more compassion/feeling...I bet he wishes he hadn't bothered now and had simply got one of his secretaries to bash out a standard typed letter for him to sign.

I do understand the mother's anger at the loss of her son, particularly if lack of equipment was a contributing factor - imo whatever the PM had done in this case would have been wrong as far as this mother was concerned.
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Jackie
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11-11-2009, 10:13 AM
Originally Posted by Hali View Post
Are you sure that they said that the protocol was for a hand written letter? I know the protocol is for the commanding offier to do a hand written letter and that the PM is to write...but I've seen nothing that says that the PM is to do a hand written letter (nor anything to say that any other PM has ever done a hand written letter).

I think its one of those things...damned if he does, damned if he doesn't. To my mind by hand writing that letter he was trying to show more compassion/feeling...I bet he wishes he hadn't bothered now and had simply got one of his secretaries to bash out a standard typed letter for him to sign.

I do understand the mother's anger at the loss of her son, particularly if lack of equipment was a contributing factor - imo whatever the PM had done in this case would have been wrong as far as this mother was concerned.
No not sure, about the "hand written" maybe in that I misunderstood it.

But the fact is he did write a hand written letter, and in doing so , he should have taken care to check it over.

I am not sure the mother of the boy who was killed woudl see it that way.

Maybe she sees it as a "consequence" of her child's life, when the man in charge, cant be bothered to spell the name right.
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Shona
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11-11-2009, 11:21 AM
Originally Posted by Jackbox View Post
No not sure, about the "hand written" maybe in that I misunderstood it.

But the fact is he did write a hand written letter, and in doing so , he should have taken care to check it over.

I am not sure the mother of the boy who was killed woudl see it that way.

Maybe she sees it as a "consequence" of her child's life, when the man in charge, cant be bothered to spell the name right.
I dont think it was that he couldnt be bothered, I think it was a mistake, pure and simple, if he couldnt be bothered then he wouldnt have sat down and penned the letter at all,
yes it was sloppy, yes it had errors, but again, as I have said already, he read out the names of the dead on tv over a week ago, when he did so, the name on the letter was the name he read out, I think he was given the wrong details.
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Ripsnorterthe2nd
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11-11-2009, 11:31 AM
Originally Posted by Jackbox View Post
I think there is far more to this, I think it is just a explosion of emotion from the citizen of this Country, we are sick of seeing body bags being brought home week in week out, we see no end to this war, and then when we see an poorly penned letter of condolence from the PM, it is bound to stir up feeling,

So its understandable the mother of this boy reacted the way she did.

Maybe she is voicing her displeasure, in the only way she can.

If the PM, cant take the time to check over the letters he is writing to the relatives of his soldiers, then what else is he falling down on,

At best he could have passed it to an aid to check for any errors!!

And we have not even touched on the recording

All he could say is "he is sorry" she feels upset"

No mention of his sorrow for the content of the letter being sloppy.
In all honesty I believe that this Mother is devastated at her Son's death and wants to take it out on someone (rightly or wrongly), so I'm afraid we'll have to agree to disagree here.
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Lorna
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11-11-2009, 11:34 AM
I think the mother will have been upset and will have taken it as an insult that her son gave up his life etc. However, I think it was wrong that she plastered it through the world's media, I think its a lovely gesture that he hand writes the letters, and I think she should have appreciated his efforts. Now I hate the labour party, but even I can see that he was trying to do a good thing there.

He's blind in one eye and partially sighted in the other, I think she's been really unfair and I think she should see what he is trying to do is a very considerate thing. At the end of the day her son signed on that dotted line and it is a lovely thing for him to do to apologise for her loss! Do you really think Tony Blair would have??
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Losos
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11-11-2009, 11:49 AM
Originally Posted by Shona View Post
when he read out the list of dead on tv a few weeks ago, he had the same name for the lad as he put on the letter, could it be a mistake made by those that give him his information?
There's no question about it Shona, when he was reading the names to the house he was reading what some civil servant had prepared for him.

Apparently, because he has only one good eye and even that is failing he has to use a thick felt writer to do handwritten letters (and mistakes are easily done with those pens) but for heavens sake surely that is a reason for sending a typed letter and putting a PS at the end "Please excuse this typed letter but due to my visual disabilty it's difficult to read my hndwriting"

It has been blown out of proportion and had far more publicity than it deserves, after all it's clear he was genuine in his desire to send condolances to the mother.

But I do have a problem with Gordon Brown which is:-
a) Will he make sure the person responsible for this error (and in turn making the British PM look a fool) is sacked, or at least demoted

b) Will he sack the Attorney General who couldn't even remember one part of the law (About illegal immigrants) that she herself wrote

I fear the answer to both questions is NO and for that reason I don't think GB has got what it takes to be PM.

I get the impression that everyone under him doesn't believe he's got the 'iron will' that is necessary for the job.
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Lorna
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11-11-2009, 11:56 AM
Originally Posted by Losos View Post
There's no question about it Shona, when he was reading the names to the house he was reading what some civil servant had prepared for him.

Apparently, because he has only one good eye and even that is failing he has to use a thick felt writer to do handwritten letters (and mistakes are easily done with those pens) but for heavens sake surely that is a reason for sending a typed letter and putting a PS at the end "Please excuse this typed letter but due to my visual disabilty it's difficult to read my hndwriting"

It has been blown out of proportion and had far more publicity than it deserves, after all it's clear he was genuine in his desire to send condolances to the mother.

But I do have a problem with Gordon Brown which is:-
a) Will he make sure the person responsible for this error (and in turn making the British PM look a fool) is sacked, or at least demoted

b) Will he sack the Attorney General who couldn't even remember one part of the law (About illegal immigrants) that she herself wrote

I fear the answer to both questions is NO and for that reason I don't think GB has got what it takes to be PM.

I get the impression that everyone under him doesn't believe he's got the 'iron will' that is necessary for the job.
I don't like him either, but I think what he did was a lovely gesture and I don't think anyone will need to lose their job, a simple, "I'm sorry" would suffice...
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Losos
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11-11-2009, 12:01 PM
Originally Posted by tinkladyv View Post
I also feel for Gordon Brown, whom i beleive is a truly gentle and genorous man who cares and would never want to hurt this woman.
Isn't that the problem He will be 'generous' over the original mistake about the name, and he has been 'generous' over the Attorney General who can't even abide by her own laws (Not ones written by others, but one she had a hand in writing herself) and there are plenty more cases where he should have been more 'hard' for want of a better word. He has been 'gentle' and 'generous' in writing to this lady, but you can't be 'gentle' and 'generous' when people are messing you about and making you look a fool.

When you are PM the people who supply you with information must get it right, or face the consequences, this whole episode has made the British Prime Minister look foolish and consequently it has made you, me, and everyone look foolish too.
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Shona
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11-11-2009, 12:05 PM
I think the Sun newspaper has done more to make him look foolish than anyone, lets face it we all know who the media work, they will always find some tiny thing and blow it up.
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Losos
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11-11-2009, 12:12 PM
Originally Posted by Shona View Post
I think he was given the wrong details.
He was Shona, of that there is no doubt, but I'm disappointed that neither he nor any of the people around him have highlighted this, they are 'protecting' the civil service rule that the beaucrats are never named and never sacked.

If I was PM I would want the person responsible named and sacked
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