I don't understand what you don't understand???? I was being sarcastic about the idiot comment just putting in my recent feelings about dealing with MT and basically coming from the same angle as you ,that they should help these dogs .

LOOK what you've started now Murf Troublemaker

Arh see its your accent I didnt get the sarcasimiwjatsot - could ne tje vodke

Me and you basically MT fans!!

Yep and Beagle Welfare they get ex breeders in as well and ex/surplus laboratory dogs

I don`t think you can get away from the fact that when a rescue takes an ex breeding bitch from a PF, they are enabling said PF to get rid of a problem.

I am not sure why this fact always gets peoples back up, I guess its down to the fact that those of you who work tirelessly for rescue and abuse of dogs, may feel you may be getting tarred with the same brush, that's not the issue here, no one is saying they should not or you should not continue, but the facts are you take one of their dogs, its a problem got rid of for them.


What would they do if rescues don't take them on, probably what many do already, get rid in other ways, but the endless circle of breeding and offloading onto others will continue till legalization is enforced to stop them breeding altogether.


Its a moral dilemma, in a way you are supporting them, and on the other hand you have to help said dogs..


I think Larrabee made a very good point, we preach tirelessly the message "don't buy from these places" yet the same logic/message is not followed for rescuing the very dogs they are using to produce their supply.

When a rescue takes in a dog from them it does open up a space for another fertile bitch, just as it does when we buy a puppy from them, it opens up more space for another litter.

Should rescues stop taking them in, that's a really hard one, head should tell you no, but heart will always tell you yes... and that's the dilemma we face, and the PF also knows this, so will continue to do as they do, until they are stopped forever.

Thats my opinion anyway, so Spot, lets not have a repeat of your blasting an opinion because it does not agree with yours.

NO, I don't have the experience of your scale in what you do, it does not stop me giving my views though, and nor should it .

I respect you immensely for your work, with greys, but sometimes people with very strong views are a little tunneled in their vision, and cant see any other viewpoint but their own.

Rescues are invaluable they do a fabulous job, its not badmouthing them to have the opinion that in taking in ex breeding bitches , they are solving a problem for a PF.

He offloads his problem and walks away with not a second thought.

Well done Murf---were you bored or something

I love it that someone who works for dogs in rescue can be accused of haveing 'tunnel vision' because they care enough to give of their time, energy and often money to save the lives of dogs regardless of where they have come from.

I went to pick up a lab pup from somewhere recently and although I had tried to gently steer the new owner away it was not my right to stamp my foot and tell them they were wrong. That pup has a great owner and will have a brilliant life----she deserves that as much as a pup from a rescue or a pup from a 'decent' breeder.

Well done I say and long may Many Tears and other great rescues flourish.

rune

Probably I'm a bit thick but I don't understand why the government don't clamp down on puppy farms. I'm sure the puppy farmers don't pay high taxes to be allowed to breed as they do, so I can't see what the government would lose by making more effort to close them down or legislate for better breeding conditions.

I look on many tears a lot. And when I have my own place I'd love to take on an ex breeding bitch and give them the home they deserve.

Who said that??? maybe you aught to read what was written

What i said was .........
Not quite the same thing

There is legislation in place, sadly it is down to the Local Authority & not the Government to implement it. The Planning Committees have to pass the plans for a commerical premises & also the Environment Health Officers inspect them on a yearly basis. The latter is usually done by the Dog Wardens(used to be a local vet years ago). Some Dog Wardens(or Animal Welfare officers as some are called)have no idea about the actual needs of a dog when it is bred from. They grant the breeding licences & have to notify the breeder before they inspect. Some DW/AWO don't like dogs & are jobsworths & as long as the dogs are fed & watered don't give a damn about anything else(as in the infamous puppy farmer in Wales featured on TV selling sick & dying puppies), others think sterile is best !

TBH I think no one should be allowed to breed more than 6 litters a year from 6 different bitches, that at least allows the breeder amply time to care for each litter(8 weeks per bitch)I do not see how anyone can correctly care for more than this.

However to get back to the topic, worthy as rescuing ex breeding animals is, it does mean that it opens up the space for another bitch to be bred from back to back(as most puppy farmers do)knowing that some rescues will always be there to pick up their leavings.

When a rescue has a very entire dog/bitch owners(as MT, RSPCA etc)have I find it very hypocritical of them to take in ex breeding dogs, whilst condemning some one for not neutering their own dogs, after all it would be harder for the PF to dispose of their worn out animals if the had to have them PTS by a vet(which is the legal way to PTS pet dogs apart from those found killing/chasing livestock & being shot by a police marksman if out of control or having a captive bolt used by a licensed person)

We have a puppy farm near here that breeds Beagles for experiments, they have been granted a licence to breed loads of litters, but have been turned down for planning permission to enlarge their premises so they have appealed to the Minister to overturn the Councils decision if they had been turned down for a breeding licence they wouldn't have been able to apply for planning permission !!