While looking at some information on e collars I read a number of case histories of dogs who had been subjected to them, some were quite horrific and very sad. Because they were on forums I can't post links to them on here.
Here from the many I have read are a couple of e collar cases from another site

The terrible thing is that there are many, many more accounts like this. Some ending with the dog being put through unnecessary suffering, some culminating in the death of a dog so traumatised by its experiences that the owner feels there is no other choice.

Ask any trainer who has seen the fall-out from the damned things and they will all say the same - ban them!!!!

Hmm well this adam isnt holding his own quite so well!

And dosent know how this invisible fence is trained with the buzzer noise and stuff
But Im not going to go into that because I dont want anyone to read what I say and try and train their dog with it - just put up a fence!

as for dogs not having a good enough recal with just treats

It is so sad that a trainer who charges money cannot teach a rewarding recal
I would say Mias recal is still not great, still a WIP, but today I called her from rabbit hunting about 500m away, she ran full pelt the whole distance and actually skidded to a sit infront of me with the biggest grin on her face - her reward - I sent her to chase rabbits again

Adam, WTH!! Anyone that knows dogs would know they don't think like us!! That is a human thought not a dog thought!! and to bait a dog up to "let the dogs really go for it" is just about the stupidest thing I have heard!!

As it has been shown to you before, dogs are not always able to understand why the pain has being caused, and for you to think the dog will just turn around and come straight back to you if foolish, the dog could run a mile, I know if you put it on the JRT I had right now that dog would take off in fear mode and could end up anywhere but near me as an e-collar would put her into a high level of fear mode, and you yourself have stated to have put it on dogs with fear issues would not be 'ideal', yet put it on dogs that need rehabilitating!! The girl I have needs rehabilitating and was dumped into the pound as a chook chaser.
You make little sense of what a 'decent' trainer would do, you may think you are one but you are nothing other than a glorified e-collar salesman.
A true trainer would know the behaviour behind prey drive, about curbing some behaviours not suppressing them and the time it takes, you look for instant results, deny any study or posts made in regards to the things that can go wrong, show you know little about dog mentality and have said nothing about a certain poster getting an e-collar on the readings of your post, with no consult on how to work it as irresponsible, dangerous and the fact there seems to be little attempt on the poster trying to curb the behaviour before resorting to a painful way about training.
Speaks volumes doesn't it

That is truly sad reading Minihaha

want for a treat does not cause discomfort,
but if you train it properally you will already be Praising/clicking the actually running bit of the recall, so he treat becomes ust a motivator, not the main form of reward.
The dog will enjoy charging back on the recall because of the excited praise the owner /trainer is giving

Can anyone do a poll? [I am not skilled enough lol]

Do you use a e collar?
Would you use an e collar?

etc etc

In reply to MichaelM

Seeing as you're so concerned about animal welfare - overall, who do you think causes the most pain and suffering for dogs: someone who uses an e-collar as they want to achieve some end result, or irresponsible breeders? How is it that you managed to accidentally produce a litter from your dogs given that you're such a concerned, responsible, caring dog lover?

Having found out that your bitch was pregnant, did you test the sire/dam for genetic problems?
No, is this testing automatic in UK for all dogs?
Were the results clear, and if not did you inform the new owners of the pups of any potenial problems?

Or did you make it clear to the prospective owners it was an accidental mating and that no health tests had been carried out?
Yes.
Did you make them sign a contract stating that if they were unable to keep the dogs for any reason then they must be returned to you, the breeder?
No no contract, but all the people who took my pups know full well that if there are any problems they can bring them straight back to me, I know most of the people who had my pups personally and the other 2 that had pups send me photos and e mails regularly to let me know how they are doing. I would not have let my pups go to anyone I wasn’t happy with If not why not, after all -you brought them into the world.

And while we're on the point of animal welfare:



Can I safely assume that all your other animals are well cared for? How can I be sure given that you too have had an accidental litter? Would you care to answer the questions I posed above to Zoe to regarding your litter?
And yes all my animals are well looked after and cared for, we work really hard on a small farm to make sure all our animals have the best life possible and I find it rude and insulting that with out knowing me you can suggest otherwise.

Jols - I think that 99.9% of the users on here wouldnt and dont use e-collars - have you read the thread - it's heated a little

Yup, and it's the main reason why I feel they need to be banned. It's basically a kind of mental torture.

It's tricking the dog and cheating the bond between dogs and humans. It's lying to the dog.

I wonder if we need to think about asking the powers that be if something could be altered on this forum? I am all for free speech, but sometimes that speech can just end up being a platform for cruelty


Wys
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