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Mahooli
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24-04-2008, 07:47 AM
Originally Posted by moetmum View Post
Do any of you ever ask yourself what happens to the deer your dogs chase? I work at the largest country park in Hampshire and I get heartily sick of the goings on. We had two young ladies out for a stroll in the country and ended up carrying back to the centre a fawn, which somebodies dog had killed, the mother of the fawn was distraught, or have you ever had to disentangle a deer that has hung itself on a fence in its panic or aborted its fawn?, or is entangled in brambles? Who picks up the vets bills that have to be paid? not any of you. You probably go home and don't give it a second thought. If your dog isn't reliable keep it on a lead. We regularly lose deer to irresponsible dog owners.
Deer are wild animals and whilst it is not right to allow your dog to chase if a deer pops up in front of you, as I have had happen, it isn't a simple matter of stopping the dogs, although my poodles give up as soon as the deer our out of sight.
Also you cannot categorically state that any deer you find tangled up is there because it has been chased by a dog. Deer are also prey animals and therefore are designed to be chased, it just so happens that in this country they no longer have any large natural predators so they are, in fact, becoming weaker as they no longer hunted by predators so I really don't think the odd chase by a pet dog will do much harm although as I said at the start that people shouldn't allow it to happen but there is no suggestion that any of those who have responded have done so.
When you have deer pop out of a hedge and walk across your path not 10 feet in front of you I defy most dogs not to chase!
Becky
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lovezois
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24-04-2008, 08:12 AM
Originally Posted by Mahooli View Post
Deer are wild animals and whilst it is not right to allow your dog to chase if a deer pops up in front of you, as I have had happen, it isn't a simple matter of stopping the dogs, although my poodles give up as soon as the deer our out of sight.
Also you cannot categorically state that any deer you find tangled up is there because it has been chased by a dog. Deer are also prey animals and therefore are designed to be chased, it just so happens that in this country they no longer have any large natural predators so they are, in fact, becoming weaker as they no longer hunted by predators so I really don't think the odd chase by a pet dog will do much harm although as I said at the start that people shouldn't allow it to happen but there is no suggestion that any of those who have responded have done so.
When you have deer pop out of a hedge and walk across your path not 10 feet in front of you I defy most dogs not to chase!
Becky

I agree 100% Becky.

Excellent post.
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basi
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24-04-2008, 08:22 AM
Originally Posted by Mahooli View Post
Deer are wild animals and whilst it is not right to allow your dog to chase if a deer pops up in front of you, as I have had happen, it isn't a simple matter of stopping the dogs, although my poodles give up as soon as the deer our out of sight.
Also you cannot categorically state that any deer you find tangled up is there because it has been chased by a dog. Deer are also prey animals and therefore are designed to be chased, it just so happens that in this country they no longer have any large natural predators so they are, in fact, becoming weaker as they no longer hunted by predators so I really don't think the odd chase by a pet dog will do much harm although as I said at the start that people shouldn't allow it to happen but there is no suggestion that any of those who have responded have done so.
When you have deer pop out of a hedge and walk across your path not 10 feet in front of you I defy most dogs not to chase!
Becky

I too agree.

There is nothing I can do or say that would stop mine from chasing deer if they were off the lead. They are bred for hunting and the instinct is just too strong.
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moetmum
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24-04-2008, 10:33 AM
I knew most people would disagree but I do feel strongly about this. My dogs would run riot given half a chance, I walk them on long leads. It is actually against the law to allow your dog to chase wildlife, if we have incidents in the park it is reported to the dog warden, if it happens on more than one occassion further action is taken.

Please bear in mind that not everybody loves dogs and those of us who read the dog press know how many councils are bringing in stricter controls on what type of dog you keep, how many, and where you can walk it. I see the day when no dog will be allowed off of its lead in a public place, it wouldn't affect me but I would hate to see that freedom taken away.

You may be interested to look at a leaflet produced by the countryside agency and the kennel club entitled you and your dog in the countryside, you can goolge it and download it, I always keep these on display in the park.

Also be aware that muntjac deer have tusks which if they are cornered or injured they will use to good effect against you dog which could result in serious injury or even death.
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basi
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24-04-2008, 10:49 AM
Originally Posted by moetmum View Post
I knew most people would disagree but I do feel strongly about this. My dogs would run riot given half a chance, I walk them on long leads. It is actually against the law to allow your dog to chase wildlife, if we have incidents in the park it is reported to the dog warden, if it happens on more than one occassion further action is taken.

Please bear in mind that not everybody loves dogs and those of us who read the dog press know how many councils are bringing in stricter controls on what type of dog you keep, how many, and where you can walk it. I see the day when no dog will be allowed off of its lead in a public place, it wouldn't affect me but I would hate to see that freedom taken away.

You may be interested to look at a leaflet produced by the countryside agency and the kennel club entitled you and your dog in the countryside, you can goolge it and download it, I always keep these on display in the park.

Also be aware that muntjac deer have tusks which if they are cornered or injured they will use to good effect against you dog which could result in serious injury or even death.
We have off lead laws here in Germany at certain times of the year. Infact a brit has just been fined £600 because her dog was seen chasing deer.
I don't allow mine off the lead unless it is an enclosed area because I know that they would and have in the past gone off after deer. I hate not being able to take them to forests and allow them to run free but I just know that they will just ignore me no matter what.
I am lucky where we are at the minute that I have a huge garden and also the use of a polo pitch to allow them to run free safely. We also have a lot of wild boar round here which could quite easily kill a dog with it's tusks, especially if they have young that they are protecting.
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Mahooli
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24-04-2008, 12:53 PM
Originally Posted by moetmum View Post
I knew most people would disagree but I do feel strongly about this. My dogs would run riot given half a chance, I walk them on long leads. It is actually against the law to allow your dog to chase wildlife, if we have incidents in the park it is reported to the dog warden, if it happens on more than one occassion further action is taken.

3 people is not most, don't tar everyone with the same brush and everyone is entitled to their opinion. If people are deliberately allowing their dogs to rampage through the countryside then yes they need to be taken to task but I reckon the vast majority of 'incidents' are just that, as I said I defy any dog not to chase if a deer pops out in front of them!

Please bear in mind that not everybody loves dogs and those of us who read the dog press know how many councils are bringing in stricter controls on what type of dog you keep, how many, and where you can walk it. I see the day when no dog will be allowed off of its lead in a public place, it wouldn't affect me but I would hate to see that freedom taken away.

You've already done that to your own dogs so what difference will it make to you? I personally don't see the day when it will happen because there would be uproar and many councils have had to back down on their dog control orders because of oppostion

Also be aware that muntjac deer have tusks which if they are cornered or injured they will use to good effect against you dog which could result in serious injury or even death.

Yes I am aware but out in the open countryside the chances of them being 'cornered' are remote, they'd disappear in a flash, they'd have to be ill or very tired to turn and fight.
No it isn't nice to see dead animals but if we had natural predators killing deer and chasing them all over the countryside killing their fawns we'd just say, oh it's nature!
Becky
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FILBS234
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24-04-2008, 01:05 PM
Well said Becky.
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Moobli
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24-04-2008, 01:07 PM
I sit rather in the middle of this debate.

I have dogs who do not chase deer. They have in the past when, as Mahooli has said, deer have popped out in front of us and I have been too slow to stop them. However, with further training I can now stop any of my dogs who may be inclined to chase.


I agree with Mahooli and others that it is hard to stop dogs chasing deer that appear suddenly if you don't have a solid "down" or "recall". However, I don't agree with the blase attitude about letting dogs chase deer simply because they are wild animals and don't have any natural predators.
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I-mac77
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24-04-2008, 01:51 PM
It is wrong for us to allow dogs to chase deer, and I don't think anyone has posted on here saying that they think it is right or that they allow their dogs to chase. However, for centurys we have been training dogs to chase, and retrieve prey, so we cannot now expect dogs to suddenly stop chasing!

Also can someone tell me when it became illegal to chase wildlife, because as far as I know dogs can still hunt rats and rabbits which are wildlife! I agree with Mahooli, deer have become weak so will get tangled up when fleeing. They don't only flee from dogs, but humans in general. I have personally watched a deer, run from me into a lorry! I had no dog, so the tangeld mess that deer are found in, isn't always caused by dogs, and that should be remembered.
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Helen
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24-04-2008, 02:23 PM
Another aspect of this is the danger the dogs put themselves in when chasing - onto roads etc. I know of 3 dogs that were killed on roads last year due to chasing deer Is it worth the risk?

The hunting with dogs law came in last year. It is still legal to hunt rats and rabbits with dogs, but not mice, hares or foxes.

Helen
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