Adam, I seriously think that along with the shock collar thing that Dogsey people are hoping can be done on you, we should also add an hour's session with the prong collar, not forgetting the quick turn and the yank (truer word than pop, no? ) and see how we go.

And video it all.

oh put it how it is Adam ,'pop and release' lol.... you mean they haven't hurt the dog enough (iyo)!!!

How do you know? I thought you said you were only interested in the dog in front of you, not what had happened previously.

The more AP posts, the more he ties himself up in knots & loses all credibility ~ it's quite funny if it weren't so sad for the dogs he comes into contact with.

Completely agree.

If anything it proves they are fine, they are not aversive enough to change behaviour on there own! In some dogs.

Adam

I asked about the history and got the full story.

Adam

Ever thought they may be pulling to try and get away from the bloody thing around their neck, that their hapless owners are tugging on?

The question was were they suitable for the general public, and by your admission, they don't work, unless the handler, does some sort of technique with them,and yanks the dog a certain way.

In what capacity was their positive training, what had been tried

On many dogs just wearing them works!

Dogs aren't stupid, they aren't going to try and pull away from discomfort if the pulling is the source of discomfort.

They will back off the pressure

Adam