hi, do i have this right - just done a bit of reading on ear cropping,

the vets basically make the pups ears from lyying flat - to constantly pricked up???

is the correct???

any more info on this would be great - so i can decided whether in for,against or neither,...

Yes I did so thanks for removing the personal details. Im quite surprised its allowed actually.

Im not sure what your point is tho I only asked a couple of questions regarding unecessary operations and the fact that people only spey because they are to lazy to look after their dogs? You have given one example of someone asking advise yet complain about generalisations.

The post wasn't used to answer you in particular just used to prove that people do have females spayed for know reason, just like ears are cropped for no particular reason, I didn't go trolling through the forum to find it I was just mouching in general and came across it.

To answer Suze
Ears are cropped differently in different country's I have boarded Russian and Polish puppys awaiting travel to England on the pet passport scheme and there ears are cut stiched and racked straight up in to a standing position.
Here in France they are cut and pulled across the top of the head until healed then are racked up for a few days, in the picture I put on of Tasha my French female her ears had only been racked up for around 4 days and they where standing on there own, I know some puppys are racked for months but it's not the norm it does only happen on occation.

Mo and the Gang

I think i have to agree with bilclarie........people dont always have dogs spayed, castrated for medical reasons.......I can understand her trying to make this point. And I also feel that as her dogs have been cropped she has had a hard time defending her position. I thought Dogsey was friendly, lets not get too carried away by our views. There are other users of the forum, who dont deserve to be made to feel they are cruel or inflict pain on their dogs.

Arh so its just most people with speyed bitches are irresponsible and mutilating their dogs?

I still dont understand why you consider speying to be mutilation but not cropping - sorry to perhaps seems to be labouring the point but I really dont understand.

As Ive said you can of course do what you want with your dogs but why are most people conisdered irresponsible just because they spey their bitches. Why is one freedom of choice the other mutilation?

I only use the word mutilation as it was thrown at me first to discribe ear cropping because I choose to own cropped dogs, can I also add yet again I do not crop ears, I do not pay a vet to crop ears, I bought 2 cropped puppys!!!! some people feel strongly about cropping which is fine we are all aloud an opinion, a dogs ears are cropped under anethetic there cut not hacked or chopped off as people have suggested they are its an operation just like spaying is only not as intrusive (sp) yes I agree there is no need to crop or continue to crop ears I totally agree with that, it is done now purley for cosmetic reasons, but given the choice I would own a cropped docked dog, some feel very strongley about this hence the topic, but I feel quite strongley about unnessasary spaying and castration, and yes a lot of people are irresponsable and a lot of people can't be asked to deal with a female season I was generalising not pointing fingers at any particular person, why is a 6 month old or any other healthy female spayed is that not cruel too, to make it go through a large operation fopr what!!!!!! ears are cropped for cosmetic reasons now and for no other reason, so unless for a health reasons why is a bitch spayed, surley you can keep it in when it's in season and when it needs to go out you can take it on a lead or just for the fertile period use the back garden to stop a male mating said female, of course you can its not hard I do it. Lets ask the question then, if anyone has had a female spayed why did you have spayed, now if everyone comes back with a valid reason for it thats fine I have no problem with that, I would rather a bitch be spayed than die from a medical condition as I have said previously I have a spayed female she had a ruptured womb and I had no choice in the matter it was life or death situation and I choose to keep my girl alive, but if it's done for the sake of it like ear cropping now is then thats a bit of a double standard in my book.


Mo and the Gang

This has (mostly) been quite an interesting thread...

When I was younger, I did like the look of a cropped ear dog, until I realised that they weren't born like that... I still quite like the look of them, but find it upsetting that (especially in this day and age) we do that purely for cosmetic reasons.

I now own (2 of) a breed that has been (in the past) docked and cropped....

My boxers have all their tails, all their ears and dewclaws; but are both castrated.

They weren't castrated for a medical (or behavioural)reason, but rather so we didn't have to keep them separate from family and friends unspeyed bitches all the time; or worry about them getting out if there was a bitch in heat somewhere.

All my dogs in the past, have been spayed for purely convenience.... when I was young my mother has all our dogs done, dog or bitches... for no other reason then , it makes life simpler....oh, and no puppies.

Many of the people I know who have dogs are spayed /neutered and done for convenience..

The times you hear....I could not cope with all that mess!!

Bandit was done at 16 months because he was scent marking in the home, so I guess I can say, it was for my convenience... Millie was done for medical reasons, she had 2 phantoms... so I though it would be better for her to be done.

Also, we seem to forget the downsides of spaying /nuetuering , spayed bitches can suffer with incontinence...Millie is going through that now.

Dogs done to early can make them a target for other dogs aggression.

Not to mention the growth rate being affected by having a dog done to young...and unfortunately it seems to be going that way.... puppies being done as young a 6 mths old.


If in the position again, I would think long and hard before I spayed or neuter a dog.

Each to their own, we are all allowed to choice what fits us best.

But I can see the point Bilclarie is trying to make..

A bitch will take far longer to recover from a spay , it is after all major surgery...a dog, not so much, but a GA is needed... we are putting our dogs through unnesassary procedures for our own ends.... what ever they may be.

Health/procreation/ convenience.

I must stress also, I am in favour of all rescues spaying/neutering their dogs. I am not agaisnt it at all.

I can see a case for both sides.

And one day my Dobermanns will all have natural ears a full tail and dew claws, I have 3 natural eared dogs now I have 2 with dew claws and cropped ears, but both my boys have there bits as there is nothing wrong with them physically, I can stop them from running off it's called training and as for females my boys live with 3 females and don't pester them if they did they would cop it from the girls, having no nutt's doesn't stop a dog mating a female it just stops them getting a female pregnant so if your dogs aren't trained they will still go looking if given the chance and will even mate, so why have them done!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Not having a go just trying to prove what some people will see as creul others won't.


Mo and the Gang

personally i look at speying completely different from ear cropping mainly as with "full ears" a bitch may not suffer from all sorts of health issues ie cancers, pyo, phantom pregnancies where as with a womb she may possible let alone controling the canine population -
ears do not produce extra puppies, deadly infections, upset for both owners and the bitch herself when in phantom or kept away from others she would ordinarily be allowed near or not exercised as she is used to.....

that is why i consider ear cropping mutilation...

Alex
xx