It's not so much that I need to know what is a high quality food and what isn't, I know that bit

It's this insistence that too much protein is a problem or that it affects behaviour, is it and does it. Is it anecdotal evidence that says so? or scientific fact?

I also did not hear anything I did not know, especially as I am a convert to raw feeding, but the one thing that I thought was good was that she did not push any brand. OK the chart she showed as a guide to shapes of dogs to see if they are underweight/size, perfect weight/size, overweight/fat was, I think, a Hills chart, but it is a generic chart used by other manufacturers/websites.

It was interesting non-the-less and I always watch the Webinars, either live or the recordings, as there might always be a bit of useful information to be gleaned.

Well as far as my research goes, quality animal protein is essential for dogs of any age. The only time protein intake should be restricted (in quantity, but high quality of protein is more important in that case) is if the dog has kidney damage, because animal proteins are processed by the kidneys.
So even older dogs should be fed a meat based, high protein diet. That's what they are made for. Wild dogs and wolves don't suddenly start eating veg and grain when they get old.
As dogs get older, they need protein to keep their bodies working and well oiled. When they start moving less they perhaps need less calories so less carbohydrates and less fat, but from what I've read and heard, in a healthy dog of any age the protein contents in the food should be quite similar if not the same.

What people don't seem to know is that dogs manufacture their own carbs from animal fats, they don't need the carbs that is in the cheap fillers used in commercial foods. Mine never ever have any form of grains whatsover, I use shredded steamed veg to bulk up their food, as obviously my older girls need less as they aren't growing anymore and as has been said they are not as active as say Keshi, and I need to make sure their weight is on the right side of lean.

Thank you all for your input so far, all interesting stuff

Any body any thoughts on the "too much protein makes them hyper" theory?

xx

I know that I can feed certain foods that are 'high status' to up someone's status if they are being picked on and stop feeding, say ox heart (v. high status) to the ones that are doing the picking. Liver, kidney and heart are all pretty high status foods and it can cause problems in a multi dog household.

There is a lot of discussions on protein levels for dogs but I haven't seen any information on why a dog needs protein, how they digest it, what it does etc? A quick search brought up http://animal.discovery.com/pets/protein-dogs-diet.htm

If we don't understand how protein works in a dog how can we give them the correct diet? There are other things a dog needs to keep them fit and healthy and we need to know how it all integrates with each other.

Protein is the building blocks of ours and our dogs bodies, it also needs to be good quality protein and not rubbish, the poorer the protein the more we have to feed our dogs to keep them fit and healthy. Puppies need protein to help them grow properly but too much protein can cause them to grow too quickly and cause other problems, not enough protein can cause a puppy not to grow properly.

Older dogs don't digest food as well as they did when they were younger, they need protein to keep them fit and healthy yet senior dog foods reduce the protein, I never understood this but then I studied horses not dogs and when my horse grew old I had to make sure he had good quality protein to keep him fit and healthy.

From that article a dog's kidney's are designed to cope with protein and get rid of any excess, protein does not cause kidney failure but poor quality protein can have a bad effect on kidneys if they are failing. When Merlin developed kidney failure my vet was happy for me to keep him on Burgess Sensitive because the protein was good quality, after checking with the manufacturers it is ?

Originally Posted by Imana-Banana View Post
The crude protein in nature Diet actually works out at 36% so it's much higher than most kibble, I agree it's a muche better quality protein though

Imana-Banana The list of ingredients content and the true analysis of the ingredients are two totally different things. For instance the 36% of protein you are referring to (i.e. the meat or fish) does not contain just protein. Its the analysis you need to look at to get the true contents of protein in dog food :- The info below has come Pet Food Review on Nature Diet Fish and Rice. But all of the Nautre Diets range are very simimlar :

Ingredients

Fish, minimum 60%, Potato, minimum 5%, Brown Rice, minimum 5%, Omega 3 (provided by Flax, Fish Oil & Meat) minimum 0. 25%, Omega 6 (provided by Flax, Fish Oil & Meat) minimum 0. 75%, Natural Ground Bone, Kelp, Herbs (Rosemary and Rubbed Sage)


Typical Analysis

Protein 10%
Oil 4%
Fibre 1%
Ash 2. 5%
Moisture 77%

So although they are stating on the ingredients that 60% is fish, only 10% of the fish is protein and there is a massive 77% of water which is very high.

I've just looked at the Orijen bag I have and they state on the ingredients that 80% is fish, only 38% is pure protein but 38% is vastly higher than the 10% in nature diet.
Ingredients on any food whether for human or animals is very confusing

Jenny, If you listen to the webinar Malka put on this thread it will tell you how to work out the protein level of wet food, it's too long for me to explain on here using my phone

Dr Chandler was, I think, good in explaining things - without lecturing. I found her easy to listen to and her explanations were good. Most of the Webinar was not really of use to me as I am a raw feeder, but I still found it interesting and worth keeping a copy of the recording.

It was the fourth Webinar that I have "attended" live since I learned about the one by Dr Laurent Garosi on epilepsy which, of course is the main thing I am interested in, but there has been one about canine spine/disc disorders and one about canine hip problems, and this last one given by Dr Chandler. And I keep the recordings so I can give the links to anyone who is interested in any of the subjects.

The Webinars are for dog owners - they are not for professionals, but none of the people giving them "talk down". They just make it easy for the man in the street who owns a dog and would like more information on certain problems to understand the whys and wherefores.