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IsoChick
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08-02-2011, 10:38 AM
Originally Posted by wilbar View Post
Surely a much simpler method would be to just stop leaving food out! After a while the behaviour would fade as there's never a reward.
Just a point - we never leave food out, as my two are established, experienced counter surfers....

They have never quit looking. The worktops can be shiny, clean and empty; and they will still stand up and look to see what's there.

They've not had a 'reward' for surfing for over a year now, and still do it - 'just in case'
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Velvetboxers
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08-02-2011, 10:44 AM
This type of training used to be quite popular.

Clearing surfaces probably works for most however a more ingenious dog will go further to open cupboards/fridges & so on to get what it wants i.e. help itself - not everyone wants to put locks on cupboards/fridges. Although ive known folk do that
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IsoChick
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08-02-2011, 10:51 AM
Originally Posted by Velvetboxers View Post
Clearing surfaces probably works for most however a more ingenious dog will go further to open cupboards/fridges & so on to get what it wants i.e. help itself - not everyone wants to put locks on cupboards/fridges. Although ive known folk do that
Max can open the microwave, and used to be able to open our old breadbin as well....
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JoedeeUK
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08-02-2011, 11:10 AM
This is one of Madam Stilwell's favourite methods, she's not a very experienced "behaviourist"she's only being doing behavour as a living for around 10 years & has no actual qualifications nor much personal experience she's only just become a dog owner !!

Far better to actually not leave food out in the first place. Also teach the leave command.

I never feed the dogs from my plate nor give them food that I am eating whilst I am eating. I do give them whatever I have left over, but either as a treat or in their dishes
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rune
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08-02-2011, 11:44 AM
Peter Neville advised a similar solution many years ago.

rune
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Tupacs2legs
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08-02-2011, 11:59 AM
.... well,even with his ears Tupac would take no notice lol
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Chris
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08-02-2011, 12:05 PM
Set dog up to fail
Apply positive punishment when unwanted behaviour starts (loud noise)
Behaviour lessens.

Not a good way to train and can have a whole host of unexpected repercussions.
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Adam P
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08-02-2011, 12:15 PM
Originally Posted by TabithaJ View Post
I know that almost all of us reject the more extreme aversives in dog training.

How about the following:

A dog keeps jumping up and snatching food from the table and counters. The trainer arranges for an extremely loud horn to sound every time the dog does it.

Then the trainer and the family leave the house - and they also leave a cake on the kitchen table. But the trainer is watching remotely and is able to sound the horn when the dog jumps up to grab the cake - the dog clearly gets a shock and immediately goes away from the table.

Did the trainer set this dog up to fail?
Is this method considered an 'aversive'?

I've described a method used by a very popular and respected dog trainer seen on TV - not Cesar Milan!

Am really interested in your thoughts - thanks in advance to those who answer
Its an effective method that works well, it can possible save the dogs life by stopping it eating something bad for it.

As we all know managment seldom works long term and it can be hard to train a dog that is super foody not to eat something it the hope that if you come back it will get a treat.

I would not use the method with a sound phobic dog though, I would use a different aversive.

Adam
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Adam P
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08-02-2011, 12:20 PM
Just to add. Stillwell still uses the technique, or a version of it. I saw an episode in the US were they had a sound system setup and when the dogs started to misbehave they ''ah ah'' or something through the sound system.

Adam
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rune
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08-02-2011, 12:24 PM
You do seem to have a strange idea that if someone uses something you agree with it HAS to be right???.

Since management has worked for me for at least 30 years with numbers of dogs running into the hundreds actually in the house as well as 20+ of my own I think we can discount your bleatings that it 'always breaks down'.

rune
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