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Location: Lincolnshire
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 8,990
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08-02-2011, 06:32 PM
Originally Posted by Tupacs2legs 
so now according to Adam Christmas is cruel to kids pmsl
It's a wonder our dogs survive
Adam is so convinced by this argument that he says he uses lots of reward during training. Mmmm!
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Location: Co. Durham
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 606
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08-02-2011, 06:45 PM
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Location: burnley, Northwest
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 520
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08-02-2011, 06:50 PM
Originally Posted by bint
I kept the prong collar that came with my dog to show anyone local on about getting one how barbaric they are. I've just put it on my arm & applied minimum pressure. I still have marks which are sore & yes it did hurt at the time too. How anyone can say these collars don't inflict pain is beyond me.
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Location: Usually in a muddy field somewhere
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 20,145
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08-02-2011, 07:03 PM
The methods you discuss are full of negativity. The dog does not anticipate the treat, or reward; all he can hope for is that the unpleasantness/pain will end soon.
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Location: The Badlands
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,889
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08-02-2011, 07:03 PM
Originally Posted by bint
I kept the prong collar that came with my dog to show anyone local on about getting one how barbaric they are. I've just put it on my arm & applied minimum pressure. I still have marks which are sore & yes it did hurt at the time too. How anyone can say these collars don't inflict pain is beyond me.
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Location: Elsewhere
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 7,227
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08-02-2011, 07:11 PM
I am still having nightmares about the last one.
A philosophical question......
When does discomfort become pain?
Put simply, I would say when it changes your behaviour.
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Location: East Midlands, UK
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 8,775
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08-02-2011, 07:56 PM
Originally Posted by Ben Mcfuzzylugs
Good for you, and I totaly agree - not just with northern breeds
Mia was similar - screaming with frustration when she got to the end of the lead and couldnt make me go further, backing up so she could get a runner and hopefully break my grip, racing round me and nipping my legs and even jumping up and nipping my bum
I could have punished her for all these behaviours and ended up with a dog who plodded at my side with now joy on her walks
But actually in many ways I saw that as a sign of how smart she was seeing what she could do to make me do what she wanted
- so I waited until she tried sitting - then I walked on
So when she gets to the end of the lead and wants to move on she knows she can manipulate me by sitting
so when I am stopped talking to friends Mia looks like an amazingly well trained dog sitting waiting - but actually she is asking me if we can get on walking But without any cruel device she learnt VERY QUICKLY that all her tantrums didnt work and to make me walk on she has to ask nicely
- and if she walks nicely at my side she sometimes gets rewarded with me jogging or walking faster - cos lets face it us humans walk sloooow
Tai barks at us when we stop to chat to friends. Very bad manners which earns him a reprimand.
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Location: UK
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 7,723
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08-02-2011, 08:40 PM
Originally Posted by Gnasher
I'm guessing here ... is Mia a collie?
Tai barks at us when we stop to chat to friends. Very bad manners which earns him a reprimand.
Yeah I made the mistake with Ben waiting till he turned back to me - but he barked at the same time so he figured barking should get me moving
I just have to wait till he isnt barking before I move on so he learns that barking means I dont walk
Its difficult when they are so slectivly smart