Hmmm....have you seen every training method ever used? Have you seen a pinch collar being used in this country? Do you think that people use them though? Have you seen an ecollar being used??? Do you doubt that people use them?
Why are you so genuinely fascinated and/or surprised that there are people out there who would train using methods like a forced fetch?

For the record...no I haven't seen it being used...had I seen it being used, or had it suggested as a training method for my dogs, I would forget I am a pacifist. I do know people who have had it suggested to them as a training method though...in this country.

Anyway...thats me done. I'm afraid you can ask away and comment further but I am not responding anymore on this thread. I don't want to be involved ina working dog thread again.

Yes I have seen a pinch collar being used. I saw a Rottweiler with one at the beach last week as a matter of fact.

Yes I have seen an e-collar being used. In fact, two dogs I walk wear them, so I have tried one on myself. Not pleasant -- horrible devices. I can also think off the top of my head a couple of people who live locally to me who use them for their dogs.

But until I see someone force fetching American style, I won't believe it!

You walk dogs that wear ecollars? Do the dogs wear them when you walk them????

As for the 'Amercian Forced Fetch'.....sigh....okay...it doesn't happen because you haven't seen it.

I do indeed.

I don't use them when I walk them, of course not. I hate them with passion (the collars) and the owner knows my feelings on them.

Do the dogs wear them when you walk them though?

No. Why?
.

Just interested....

Ramble,

Don't go!

I think there can be (not necessarily from people on here) a tendency for those who work their dogs, or those who train dogs to work, to see themeselves as people who truly understand dogs...as people who understand dogs heaps better than those who 'just' have pets. Such people think that 'working' dogs are different to other dogs...they are proper dogs that have wonderful lives...but that need to be handled 'properly' not like pets are.Such dogs need firmer handling techniques (apparently) than 'pet' dogs..as they need to work, not just lie by the fire.
I have encountered this attitude with lots of different types of 'working dog' people...(I hasten to add their comments have included me as one of them for some pecualiar reason...)
I find such attitudes frustrating and appalling in many ways...this tendency to assume that people who have pets really don't understand dogs. Why wouldn't they?


My 'outta here' was this particular discussion, I see absolutely no point in just going round in circles, it's all a bit too immature for my liking.

Regarding people who train and work their dogs, I actually haven't found them to be how you have described, the people you refer to I have found to be in far greater numbers on these kind of forums - very practised at talking the talk! I have my own share of experience of working dogs, it's not a vast amount and not all gained in this country. I also trained my current young lad in schutzhund for 7/8 months of last year, I've been off due to a torn cartilage injury for the last 6 months, so have just been furthering my knowledge and studying working dog drives and training of late. Many working dog experts and enthusiasts in my experience are so far removed from the self promoting and defensive posts of the well practiced forum poster, you see on many forums.

Maybe catch up with you on another thread!

I find most people in dogs, be it schutzhund, obed, showing, gun dogs, what ever, tend to feel there view, way is the only way,

As someone who deals with all of the above, and more, I think I have learned there is value to be gained from most enthusiasts if they will only take on board, that there way is not the only way,

Do we start a new thread for this topic? Have you heard the expression "the only thing two trainers will agree on is what another trainer is doing wrong"?