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Jackie
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04-07-2013, 02:02 PM
Originally Posted by Gemini54 View Post
Hi Surely if you have children playing,and all at once there is a lot of activity regarding police,wouldnt it be sensible to bring every one in,the police may not have weapons,but the people they are after may have. I know I would just in case someone gets hurt Gemini54
Of the streets then yes, but from your own secure back garden, can you imagine the scenario ... Your kids or dogs are playing happily in the garden, you hear a police siren.... Are you really suggesting you should panic with the thought.....oh god, quick gets the kids/ dogs in and shut all doors, just in case the police are going to come crashing into my back garden.
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Gemini54
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04-07-2013, 08:13 PM
Originally Posted by Jackbox View Post
Of the streets then yes, but from your own secure back garden, can you imagine the scenario ... Your kids or dogs are playing happily in the garden, you hear a police siren.... Are you really suggesting you should panic with the thought.....oh god, quick gets the kids/ dogs in and shut all doors, just in case the police are going to come crashing into my back garden.
Hi Not everything is black and white, some areas are grey,to me its common sense if there is unusual activity in your area and is generated by the police,they are looking to catch someone because they have commited an offence,that person is not going to worry who is there,and could run into your garden and if they are cornered are you still going to leave children in the garden happily playing,I don't think so. We are lucky that our police are not armed,in the states they would be pulling a gun out on the suspect in your safe haven of a garden where your children are happily playing. Gemini54
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Tang
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04-07-2013, 08:31 PM
Do you think they send out advance warning to all households when they are in pursuit of criminals?

My guess is that this all happened very quickly.

I've seen the police come swarming over the back fence of a house near me in Berkshire. First I knew was when my dog went nuts. And they apparently got the WRONG bloody house! No door numbers round the back and they all looked pretty similar! I certainly didn't hear them coming - didn't know anything about it until I saw them appearing over the back fence. I'm just glad they didn't get my house by mistake!

And that was apparently to try to arrest a night club manager who was suspected of misappropriating the takings on the door, not an armed and dangerous thug.

What is your point Gemini? I'm puzzled. Are you saying that it is the fault of the boy's mother or grandmother for not knowing the police were coming and yanking him indoors before they got there?

And if you've ever lived in a big city - sirens are everyday noise, sometimes all day every blimmin day! Police, Fire Engines, Ambulances. I don't know any parents who would yank their children in from their own back garden because they heard a police car siren somewhere outside.
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spot
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04-07-2013, 09:24 PM
Originally Posted by Gemini54 View Post
Hi Not everything is black and white, some areas are grey,to me its common sense if there is unusual activity in your area and is generated by the police,they are looking to catch someone because they have commited an offence,that person is not going to worry who is there,and could run into your garden and if they are cornered are you still going to leave children in the garden happily playing,I don't think so. We are lucky that our police are not armed,in the states they would be pulling a gun out on the suspect in your safe haven of a garden where your children are happily playing. Gemini54
I certainly see where you are coming from = it would make sense to me to do that. Unfortunately it would appear that to some on here the police can do nothing right, I just hope these people never have the need to call upon them to help them out if someone does come into their garden/house as they will need to have a hand written invite, have RSPV's and taken note of the ruddy dress code at this rate.

Blame culture again, I can hear it now - 'they came out of nowhere, they sent my 93 year old mother into shock, made my 7 month old come out in hives so I need at least £93m to make it all better'

The one person no-one seems to blame here is the criminal
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Rosebud77
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05-07-2013, 02:42 AM
Originally Posted by spot View Post
I certainly see where you are coming from = it would make sense to me to do that. Unfortunately it would appear that to some on here the police can do nothing right, I just hope these people never have the need to call upon them to help them out if someone does come into their garden/house as they will need to have a hand written invite, have RSPV's and taken note of the ruddy dress code at this rate.

Blame culture again, I can hear it now - 'they came out of nowhere, they sent my 93 year old mother into shock, made my 7 month old come out in hives so I need at least £93m to make it all better'

The one person no-one seems to blame here is the criminal
Frankly a ridiculous post - unless the UK is now a police state of course. Warrants are needed and are safeguards to prevent this kind of event and to protect children.

You seem to forget that a child needed 40 stitches and is scarred for life and will probably always be terrified of dogs.

The police are supposed to be protectors not aggressors.
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Rosebud77
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05-07-2013, 05:22 AM
Originally Posted by Tangutica View Post
Do you think they send out advance warning to all households when they are in pursuit of criminals?

My guess is that this all happened very quickly.

I've seen the police come swarming over the back fence of a house near me in Berkshire. First I knew was when my dog went nuts. And they apparently got the WRONG bloody house! No door numbers round the back and they all looked pretty similar! I certainly didn't hear them coming - didn't know anything about it until I saw them appearing over the back fence. I'm just glad they didn't get my house by mistake!

And that was apparently to try to arrest a night club manager who was suspected of misappropriating the takings on the door, not an armed and dangerous thug.

What is your point Gemini? I'm puzzled. Are you saying that it is the fault of the boy's mother or grandmother for not knowing the police were coming and yanking him indoors before they got there?

And if you've ever lived in a big city - sirens are everyday noise, sometimes all day every blimmin day! Police, Fire Engines, Ambulances. I don't know any parents who would yank their children in from their own back garden because they heard a police car siren somewhere outside.
Pat; see this recent news here

Gardaí swoop

on Bonane house

Residents in Bonane, near Kenmare, are to hold a special Community Alert meeting to discuss their concerns over a high-powered garda swoop that took place early last Wednesday morning.

A senior garda source has confirmed the raid this week which involved up to nine gardaí from outside the Kerry Garda Division. Armed, dressed in black and believed to be from the Emergency Response Unit (ERU), they gained entry through the back and front of an occupied house in a rural area shortly before 8am. It is understood they were carrying out a search operation for a suspect wanted in relation to a serious crime in the UK.
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Apache
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05-07-2013, 07:21 AM
Originally Posted by spot View Post
Unfortunately it would appear that to some on here the police can do nothing right, I just hope these people never have the need to call upon them
I think you have hit the nail on the head here Spot and Gemini. Some on here (Les Tricoteuse) seem to be almost in a state of glee that the police got it wrong on this occasion. This was an accident pure and simple, I am sure the policeman concerned will learn from this and hopefully the inquiry will identify potential improvements in procedure for the future. I am also sure there will be substantial compensation paid to the boy's parents. I just hope the dog isn't made the scapegoat.

So glad I posted this item as it has sparked a lively contentious debate between all you dog lovers. Will have my champagne and strawberries ready for the match this afternoon. Come on Andy, you can do it.
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Apache
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05-07-2013, 07:23 AM
Originally Posted by Rosebud77 View Post

You seem to forget that a child needed 40 stitches
I think you will find it was 20 stitches, not 40.
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Apache
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05-07-2013, 07:32 AM
Originally Posted by Rosebud77 View Post
Warrants are needed and are safeguards to prevent this kind of event and to protect children.
No, warrants are not needed to enter premises, see below. They were in pursuit of thieves to make an arrest, and therefore were completely within the law to enter the garden (and house if needs be).

Situations in which the police can enter premises without a warrant include when they want to:

deal with a breach of the peace or prevent it
enforce an arrest warrant
arrest a person in connection with certain offences
recapture someone who has escaped from custody
save life or prevent serious damage to property.
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Apache
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05-07-2013, 07:47 AM
Originally Posted by Rosebud77 View Post
The police are supposed to be protectors not aggressors.
Indeed they are. How does an accident make them aggressors? There was no intention to cause injury, this is fundamental to this situation. What the police now need to do is analyse the events leading up to the incident to find out how it might have been prevented.
Accidents occur every day, unforeseen, unplanned and it's what keeps insurance companies in business.
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