Breeding Unregistered dogs-your thoughts?

Was just trawling some of those "add" sites (in search of a hammock!) and was surprised by the amount of, and i quote "Parents Purebred but not KC registered, hence pups not registered" pups there were-and numerable breeds too!
So just wondered what your thoughts on breeding NON-registered dogs?
Also..how could one tell if these dogs were in actual fact, for example, pure border collie, if there is no traceable history?

I don't know Luke but I have just seen some Bichons advertised in Loot for £120.00 and it said they can deliver

There may be a few genuine people who dont want to register their pups ,but I am guessing most are from people who are breeding at every litter for profit ,using cross bred parents ,using dogs who are not on the active register ,breeding too old or too young
You have to wonder why they are not registered ,most of the time its prob not going to be a good reason

If a person is going to produce puppies regardless of their family tree/history. They might very well have no regard for health, temprament or breed type either. I don't call these people breeders. The title of breeder I reserve for someone who spends many years learning about a breed from mentors that have long and successful experience themselves, and breed a litter carefully when they want to keep a puppy for themselves. These other people are puppy farmers or puppy producers or backyard breeders.

These are the people that do all the damage to breeds that for one reason or another, become popular or fashionable. It happens because these people don't care about thre pups their mums or the breed as a whole as long as they get their money. Or, as long as they get their wish to have a litter from their pet, just because they want to.

The problem with all this, is that the gullible, unknowing, inexperienced and ignorant (meant as in, unaware) public get caught out and misled. Then they end up with all sorts of health and welfare problems, and nobody to ask for help and support.

My advice to anyone that wants to add a puppy to their family is, contact the breed clubs for advice and join in the organised activities. Mix with the people who are experienced in their breed, talk to these people about all aspects of living with the breed, buy books, don't rush into anything and do your research. Be prepared to wait for the right puppy, don't just expect one to be available off the shelf so to speak. Always see the puppies with their mother, and if something doesn't look right.........Run

Dawn R.

There are several reasons that dogs lose their KC(or other registry)registration.

It is mainly to do with money. For example Irish Setters have to be tested clear of CLAD otherwise the KC will not register the puppies, The International Sheepdog Society insists on all dogs over 2 years old having to be tested clear of CEA/PRA & for a puppy to be reistered both owners(stud & bitch)must be ISDS members.

Lots of people can't be bothered/don't want to spend money to test so they breed from their dogs untested & not bother to register the puppies & so when the puppies are bred from their puppies can't be registered either

The KC has an upper age limit on bitches after which without permission being granted before the bitch is bred from puppies again cannot be registered, also if the bitch has had more than 6 litters the KC will not register puppies.

I personally would not buy any puppy that wasn't from fully health tested parents & that was registered with an "proper"registry appropriate for the breed

Unfortunately the breeders of "designer"cross breeds etc are 99% of the time interested in only one thing the £ sign followed by lots of 0's after the number !(Seen certain X breeds on offer at £1,000 a puppy !!!)

I agree with Nursey and Joedee here, no registration, no care IMO. This is why you get so many "types" of dogs such as Yorkie, Westie, Cavaliers etc.... none of them look like they are supposed to and most of them have health problems of one sort or another. Just irresponsible breeding.
Dawn.

Have to say I agree with all of the above. Isla has prognency not eligible for registration on her certificate, which I totally agree with. The breeder is happy to lift this as long as I undertake all the health tests before breeding, it's the way it should be done and shows that they care about their dogs and the future of the breed.

The above may also be the reason that some "breeders" don't register?

I'm afraid I wouldn't go near a dog that wasn't registered in some way, you just can't be sure these days.

Personally I don't believe that ALL breeders of unregisterd dogs .. do so with only £ signs in mind or that they don't give a damn about the health and well being of their bitch. owners of unregistered dogs can and are as responsible as some registered breeders.......my mum has " Unregistered" bitches, 5 generation pedigrees but the so called reputable breeder refused (after purchase) to register them despite the advert saying they were KC reg, despite my mum offering to pay for the registration, the breeder would not Reg the pups.... the only conclusion we can come to .. is that this so called legit breeder is breeding her bitches 2 x a year one litter reg ,one not
I think that some times "pet quality" pups are probably from a better background than some of the so called "pro breeders" ,for my money I would prefer a pup born and brought up in a family home, with all that entails............ compared to a show dog that was not used to people and lived its life in a 6x3 concrete run.. at the end of the day I suppose it's what you want from your dog .. I want a great pet ..and don't mind if that pup is from a "hobby" breeder....
Like every one else I am surprised at the prices being asked for some of the pups on the "net" chi X breeds are fetching over £1000 pound.. but its a buyers market if they were too expensive then they wouldn't sell .... clearly some people are happy to pay that much for them.. all the time people will pay it .. people will charge that for their pups...

Rachel

The fact that this breeder could be breeding more litters than is allowed by the KC makes me wonder if they're doing it for the money and that is enough for me to run a mile I'm afraid. Although I'm sure your Mum's dogs are lovely.

I think the thing that concerns me about unregistered litters is the fact that they're most likely not health tested. On KC reg forms now the parents have details of any health tests carried out on them. This is a big draw for me as it's written proof that the upmost has been done to ensure that the health of the animals has been seriously considered. I think the reason I'm like this is cos I've yet to meet a breeder of unregistered litters that does health test.

You can get bad in both sides of the coin though, I'm sure there are some terrible show breeders out there that do it purley for their own gain. But that is for the potential owner to suss out, looking at the environment asking questions etc. Personally I'd rather go for a show breeder (or anyone with professional knowledge of breeding eg working dogs) as I feel they have a lot of knowledge about their breed and breeding, as opposed to a "pet" breeder that could have knowledge of breeding but no knowledge of the health problems in the breed etc.

I think what I'm trying to get at is the good professionals have a reason to breed - to better it and usually to better their lines, therefore they'll put a lot of time and effort into breeding pups. Pet breeders don't have this need so from my perspective would be less inclined to undertake all the health tests etc.

Not all show dogs are confined to runs or treated like commodities. My pup is from a show and working breeder, but their dogs are like family to them and are treated as such. Plus I have the knowledge that everything possible was done to ensure that they're going to be fit and healthy for years to come. For me there's no price on earth you can put on that.

I agree with most of what Nursey and Joedee has written.

I really wish everyone who's interested in getting a pup reads two of our most important quick start guides:

#1 Dogs - just to ram home what dog ownership entails

and

#2 Dog Breeders - so people can see that not all breeders are the same, and see the difference between a dedicated ethical breeder and a BYB or Farmer.

You can see them by clicking on:

http://www.dogsey.com/dogs.htm

and

http://www.dogsey.com/dog-breeders.htm

And anyone who's even thinking about breeding to read this article by SB: http://www.dogsey.com/dog-articles.php?t=12589