Is this Robbie guarding his pack?

Just wanted to ask what you all thought of this.

At home there is me and Steve and we have Robbie and Lady and we are presuming that they now consider us four as part of a pack. I think that I am at the top of the pack as it is me that feeds them and does most of the walking and they both act slightly differently towards me than they do to Steve. They will jump on him if he lets them but won’t jump on me. Robbie acts very coy and soppy round me, suppose it is him being submissive.

For the last few weeks, Steve’s nephew, Jack, has been up from London, (11 years old) and has been staying with Steve’s mum in the week and with us at the weekends. Lady is great with him and when he stays over, he has the sofa bed down in the back room. Normally the bed is folded up into a sofa and Lady sleeps on it a lot, but when Jack stays over, she starts off on it with him at night and then migrates onto her bed in our room sometime in the night.

Robbie likes Jack to a certain extent but does growl at him sometimes. If Jack is stroking his ears, after a few minutes you can hear Robbie rumbling, and over the weekend, Jack hugged him round his neck and he growled and shook him off. He didn't go to bite him so that's not an issue, it was more of a 'Get off me!'

Robbie doesn’t seem to have any issues with us two holding or hugging him round his head or neck so don’t think that’s a problem.

Robbie can be very timid with some people and we do have a few male friends who he will not go near, he won’t go near my Dad, who is very dog friendly (we always had a dog while growing up and my Dad’s dog died a few years ago and he was devastated so it’s not as though he doesn’t know dogs).

Robbie has no problem with women and we think that where ever he has been before us, he has had some issues with males in the past, maybe coming into his pack, and that Jack staying over has made him feel that his pack is being disrupted.

It’s not a problem for us, and over time we are sure Robbie will get that way he couldn’t care who was in the house with us. Since they both came to us, his confidence has come on a lot and he is now initiating playing with us, rather than us trying to get him to play.

What does anyone else think of this?

i guess the adaptation of the environment also matters.. it takes time even to humans.... but if you keep on interacting with it then it'll be much easier for him....

Sounds to me as if he just isn't used to children.

How do you react when he growls or shakes Jack off?

I never thought of him not being used to children - there are other children that come to the house that he has met but they are not as hands on with dogs as Jack is. They will stroke him once or twice on his back and that's it, they lose interest and leave him alone and he is happy with that. Jack is more tactile with the dogs and likes to stroke and fuss them.

He has only growled at him once last week and shock him off once this weekend and whenever he has done it, I have asked him 'now what was that for!' in a scolding voice and he has gone all soppy and trying to lick me as though he was saying sorry.

I think you`re reading human emotions unto what your dog does (sorry). Dogs don`t really think in terms of hierarchy and they really aren`t bright enough to work out relationships and ages.
Children tend to have sudden movements and are unpredictable, which worries dogs who aren`t used to it. People they don`t know can cause an unconfident dog to be anxious.
If a dog growls it`s a warning that he is uncomfortable about something. It could be pain, stress or fear. Grabbing a dog round the neck and looming over him is a very threatening thing to a dog (I know the child didn`t mean it to be but the dog doesn`t know that. )
I would try to educate the boy into `dog-friendly` body language. He will hopefully find it interesting.
For instance - a stare into dogs` eyes is intimidating to a dog. It is a direct challenge, and means an attack could be coming. Patting a dog on top of the head is also a stressful thing - it indicates that you are insisting you are `higher/ stronger` than the dog. Pushing your face up close to a dogs` face is also (to a dog) aggressive body language.
Now to us, a close cuddle, stroke and loving glance is an expression of affection. To a dog they could be (unless they have learned differently) a sign that we are about to attack them!
How about asking Jack to do some training with Robbie? Reward-based training is great for bonding.
A good book is The Culture Clash by Jean Donaldson, which explains behaviour and training in a very clear way.

Primates hug, canines don't and usually don't like it. Just why he tolerates if from others is hard to say. Perhaps it has to do with rank and gender. Well socialized males will never attack a female.

I told Jack that Robbie shock him off because he didn't know what Jack was doing and that he moved too fast for Robbie to see where he was.

We went to a dog show on Sunday and we did tell Jack that if he saw a dog he wanted to stroke, he should go down to the dog's level and offer his hand first to be sniffed and then if the dog was happy with that and came to him, then he could try and stroke it but not to touch their head if they don't know him and definately not stroke a dog from behind in case they don't know he is there.

Just to add...when dogs growl it is a WARNING sign, an early one at that, he is showing he doesnt want whatever is being done to him to continue. you say he never went to bite so its not an issue...that is the wrong attitude to have as that is how kids and people get bitten- because the owners have not read or noticed the warning signs.
when he realises that growling is getting nowhere the next step for most dogs would be to bite- in their minds they have given ample warning to stop the situation.

whenever he shows any signs of growling etc he should be removed from the situation, but ideally it wouldnt go so far as to allow him to get to the satge of growling.

and should ask the owners first, ive lost count of the times kids stroke sadie without asking at shows- just aswel shes sociable

I wouldn't tell a child(or an adult come to that)to go to a dogs level to touch a dog, better to first offer the back of a closed fist(ie the knuckles & hand between knuckles & wrist with fingers curled underneath)because there is much least risk if the dog reacts badly & then with an open palm to offer a treat placed in the palm(a bit like giving a horse a treat)if the owner agrees.

As to your dog, a good idea is to get the child to help training a few simple things like giving a paw, sitting on command, laying down on command. Even having a go with a bit of clicker training.

Dogs never see humans as a part of their"pack"they know humans are not dogs & that they are not humans.

One thing 99% of dogs like is having a bit of massage & doing a bit of circular massage(as in T Touch)usually has the dog relaxing & even going into an almost trance like state!