Sorry Dawn, I disagree. Hunting is working, not the other way around, and it's only one form of working

Ok then, lets look at it objectively..regardless of whether we agree with it or not.
Forget the word hunting....let's say ...
'Sport' is for entertainment/pleasure
'Working' is performing a task/or for the purposes of obtaining food....
some things cross over between the two ....

those things Becs already mentioned involved with restraint/search/rescue.( Sport and working)
retrieval of game (including on the big shoots) .( Sport and working)
rabbiting.( Sport and working)
ratting .( Sport and working)
rounding sheep and cattle . .( Sport and working)
hearing dogs (working)
dogs for the disabled (working)
guide dogs (working
PAT (working)
sledding .( Sport and working)

No amts - just general.

Borderdawn,

If you really want a hunting section it would probably be more useful to give contructive reasons why there should be a section as amts is trying to do. You seem to have resigned yourself to the fact that it wont happen before it's even been decided. You are getting the opportunity to put your side forward and not taking advantage of it. Personally I think you are dissuading people by your attitude not your arguments.

Graeme

Ok Just being oversensitive as most others when it comes to this.
Should be home in my new pool now but want so bad to be a part of this and be able to explain what I do and why.
I feel I can only tell, learn and share if I cover it up with words that doesnt show what we really do and feel its unfair and sad really.

I dont know where this will lead us, but hopefully some (most) of us will learn a bit and be able to see and respect both sides after this (when we´re done that is).

As for the being upset i can honestly say some posts in other sections upsets me too. I often either stay out of them then or get my butt kicked as I have trouble getting my points out in english.
But by making the section, as suggested, hidden we have a choice. Do we want to enter?
We also have that choice even if it isnt hidden

I've lost the plot I will agree to anything so long as there is no graphic discription of animals/birds being killed and no gory pictures.

Mo

Thank you amts, glad I made sense, at least to you ...It's a topic I have to say I don't know to much about but just had some thoughts

I think the main thing that I am thinking of here, as someone who is a bit not sure about hunting and who sits on the fence a little, is that I can't say for instance that I want to see a picture of 'Rovers' fresh kill taken this morning...But on the other hand I am very interested in learning about the original job of of certain types of working dogs that were used for hunting.

I.E. in a retrospective look back at what the original job was and how it was carried out. I don't think most of us would have a problem reading or learning about the history from centuries ago...But many will be offended at reading about it as it happens.

When these dogs were bred for different hunting purposes there was a real need for it 100's of years ago, people couldn't just pop down to Tesco's / the local supermarket and pick up a chicken or duck etc for dinner, so they had to get there own and the use of dogs was one way to do it People had to eat and they wern't wrapped up in cotton wool and protected from having to kill to get meat as we are, for most of us, lucky to be now.

I think alot of hunting that goes on nowadays is for sport and adreniline and unlike how it was originally, that is why I am more happy to listen to examples in retrospect...But of course you still do have the authentic side of it all where there is a need for live stock owners to do what they have to do but people will be more uncomfortable with hearing about 'now'.

I feel for people on both sides and understand all opinions...Hope we can sort out a happy medium for you all soon

Dear Everyone who has posted on this thread,
As you may know i often use my JRt and WHWT cross DDt to sort out the local rats, mice, shrews, water rats. But nothing else, really so basically i wouldnt be classed as 'working' terriers. To be honest i couldtn give care less, whether people use their dogs to purposley kill vermin, or like mien they just do, and their owner doesnt seem to bothered by this, or whether they dont, that is a thing called freedom of will. And as England is a supposeldy free country we should allways be able to have the freedom of speech and thought.
I am very heavy on animal rights, animal testing, cruelty, racing grey hounds etc. But when it comes to wild mice rats etc, it is a different matter tey are verminous and carry disease, they would and i ahve known them to kill pet rabbits and guinea-pigs, happened to me.
I keep rabbits and guinea's but they are pets, there is a difference between them and what roams the country, although i dont encourage mien to go rabbiting as i do liek to0 see baby rabbits hopping around.
Foxes i have a strong hatrid for, they nearly wiped out all my pet rabbits and guinea=pigs, killed the families mini yorkie pup, has even been known to kill cats, they also can caus disastourous effects to people lively hoods. Fox hunting is a different thing to hunting a fox with a terrier, even though i havent, nor intend on doing so with mine or ever. I DO NOT approve of cubbing, this is cruel and sick, and i dont care if i cause offense, killing young foxes at an age before they ahve even had chance to live, is barabaric. Whether they are babies or young adults they still havent lived, and it is na cruel and pointless thing to do..
Terriers handle things very different, for example a terrier hunting rabbits, does the infamous terrier shake, and then thats it done and finsihed, a pack of hounds would rip an animal apart.
Snares are also barabaric, this is someone whom lost a cat a few years ago to snaring, it is cruel and unecesary.


I want to specify something i dont purposlet take my dogs out to kill, it is just something they do,and i cant stop. I wouldnt take pictures nor glorify the matter, recently the dogs had, a rat, and i was taking pictures of the garden and rabbits, at the time, and i wnet to take some of the dogs assing around by the shed, and then i didnt notice about the pics that well the rat was no more.
I think it is a matter of personal choice, but working a terrier, may seem cruel but it is quick and non glorifyed
I think to make a section for dogs used in the field in various ways, would be something that would cause a tear between Dog Web, some people do not approve of hunintg, nor killing an naimal, nor sleding a dog, nor using a dog despite its instinct to, herd other animals. And this is very well an infivifual's choice, and to put it on a public forum would make much more harm then good, offending people is by sure nobodys intention, at least it shouldnt be.
Although on the other hand, people whom use their dogs 'in the field' or for sleding or for herding etc, should not feel isolated nor shunned, people whom use their dogs for such should also be entitled to freedom of speech and thought.
On a whole it is a touchy subject, i hate to see an animal suffer, but using dogs to see to vermin is a different matter, these are creatures that spread disease, havbe been known to kill livestock and pets, and have been known to devestate one's livelyhood. I detest people whom make it something it isnt, it should be a way of managing vermin, not a sport, not for fun, and certainly not as a hobby. It is a duty that one would perform with good intewntions in mind, but other peoples views opften make the subject something it isnt into a drama.

I can see where both parties are coming from, and it would be awful if one side were offended, or the other side left through feeling shunned.
This is my letter to you all, and i hope it proves in good stead
Best wishes
Luke

Please don't worry about getting butt kicked - if you are offended by something then say so. Nobody will think any the worse of you - we are all different and have different likes and dislikes. That's what makes the world go around and you are entitled to your opinion.

You and I clearly disagree on hunting, but it's nothing personal. It's good to debate.

I am okay with stuff about training/breeding/feeding with regards to the hunting dog - and I'd be interested, but I don't want to read about animals or birds being killed, that's all. I know that some dogs will hunt and kill naturally. The staff across the road brought down a small deer and Loki does his best to get birds and rabbits. It will happen one day, I'm sure, and I won't be cross as I understand it would be part of his nature but I would prefer it didn't.

Write your piece for Azz and see what he thinks. Might as well give it a go.

i would not like to even read about animals that have been killed
sorry