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Hewey
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16-04-2007, 09:15 PM
Originally Posted by IanTaylor View Post
I think reasonable deployment of their resources... would be to police our streets and make them safe.....

I'm sorry but I've tried to see your point of view but it seems to me your living in some perfect land far far away.. where the baddy always ends up the loser.... I just sincerely hope you never need a copper in any urgency
I think that is a very personal comment I could equally say I don't recognise the world as you see it, doesn't advance the discussion any does it?
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Azz
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16-04-2007, 09:19 PM
Originally Posted by eloquence View Post
vigilante activities - for crying out loud.
That is the case when people take the law into their own hands isn't it?

Originally Posted by eloquence View Post
excuse me - that was below the belt!
I think it was a fair point. Far too many people fail to even begin to contemplate that they themselves may be at fault.
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leo
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16-04-2007, 09:20 PM
ok i said i wouldn't reply....
can you explain to me why you have so much faith in the system? i just find it hard to grasp, have you never lost your temper or acted out of character over any thing? have you always had such self control?
surely you must see the crime and violence in the world even if you haven't been affected by it directly.
i hope your never in a situtation where you have so much faith in the system then let down by it.
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Tee
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16-04-2007, 09:24 PM
I haven't read ALL the posts on here but get the gist of it..

I am not a violent person at all, never been in a fight except for a couple of scraps in school. That said, I wouldn't hesitate to fight back if someone thought they could physically attack me or mine. I'm not easily provoked, no-one could provoke me to use physical force through words but if my safety was at threat, I'd do whatever I deemed necessary to protect myself. I'd like to think I'd only go as far as defending myself in the event of attack, that would be the 'right' thing to do but when adrenaline takes over and I know that someone has tried to cause me real harm, realistically I think I would deal with them in a way that would ensure they wouldn't bother me again.

I'm from one of the so called 'rough areas' of Nottingham and have never, ever had any trouble from anyone, nothing a few harsh words didn't sort. I'd rather walk away from a situation that I can see building up but still, some people want to cause real harm and I am not going to be a victim. As for the justice system in this country, lol. I have very little faith in the criminal justice system in this country. Many people from my community have died in police custody, died at the hands of the police who are supposed to protect us so you'll forgive me when I say I have very little faith in them.
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Azz
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16-04-2007, 09:27 PM
Originally Posted by IanTaylor View Post
I'm sorry but I've tried to see your point of view but it seems to me your living in some perfect land far far away.. where the baddy always ends up the loser....
I have to disagree with you there. I see Heweys point of view very clearly and I haven't lived anywhere near a perfect land far far away
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Hewey
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16-04-2007, 09:41 PM
Originally Posted by leo View Post
ok i said i wouldn't reply....
can you explain to me why you have so much faith in the system? i just find it hard to grasp, have you never lost your temper or acted out of character over any thing? have you always had such self control?
surely you must see the crime and violence in the world even if you haven't been affected by it directly.
i hope your never in a situtation where you have so much faith in the system then let down by it.
Yes I see crime and violence in the world but we are largely well policed and our justice system is a model used around the world. If it is failing some people I think we need to ask why rather than to just say some groups of society should be allowed to police themselves. While people have been very occupied in discussing whether violence has any place I think we have lost sight a little of the fact that many situations don't need to become a conflict if managed differently. I think I have already said it is easier to maintain self control when you are quite clear than hotheaded actions are not your best option under any circumstances. The knock on effect, of course, is those exhibiting self control have a calming influence and you are even less likely to face conflict in the first place.
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leo
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16-04-2007, 09:47 PM
but can you see that in some situtations with some ppl in our society communication doesn't work, i agree with some cases could be avoided if handled in a different manner to start with but not all, some conflict will and do happen even with the correct handling to try and stop it from becoming violent.
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Hewey
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16-04-2007, 10:09 PM
Originally Posted by leo View Post
but can you see that in some situtations with some ppl in our society communication doesn't work, i agree with some cases could be avoided if handled in a different manner to start with but not all, some conflict will and do happen even with the correct handling to try and stop it from becoming violent.
Yes, I understand it will not always be successful.
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shiba
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16-04-2007, 10:18 PM
i'm back - complete with baseball bat

Computer plays up for a few hours and we are now on page 16 - wow. I think that says alot about peoples experiences and how strong we feel about the policing today.

I for one have said previously - i have no expectations on the "men in blue" turning up and rescueing me if i needed it. This is totally on past experience, they do not turn up. I have witnessed time and time again, the "badies" get an easy deal with things.

Hewey i have now asked you several times to share your experiences with me, regarding a situation that you felt extremely threatened and you talked your way out of it with a happy ending. As yet, i haven't seen your answer.

When my mum was burgled, at the time in a wheel chair, terminally ill with only months left to live. I took her out for a stroll in her chair. On returning, her house was trashed by a burglar. It is a terrible memory for me as it is one time my mum was reduced to tears. The police did not even come out to fingerprint.

I was so angry i did my own "investigating". Asking in pubs etc, and cutting a long story short found out who had done this. I called the police and told them this info and asked for someone to visit him to see if there was any items (evidence) still at his flat. There reply, they were too busy and couldn't just go around like that.

My response of pure anger was "i am now putting togeather 18 people who will turn up at this guys house and give him a beating, you will have to come out then anyway. I then hung up. (i was so so angry at the time).

Minutes later my phone rang, it was a sargent, who told me to please hold off, he would get a warrent in the morning and they will look into this. I thanked him, the next day the guy was arrested, and served 3 years. Which i am extremely proud of but why could the police not sort this out without the mention of violence.
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Lucky Star
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16-04-2007, 10:34 PM
Originally Posted by Hewey View Post
While people have been very occupied in discussing whether violence has any place I think we have lost sight a little of the fact that many situations don't need to become a conflict if managed differently. I think I have already said it is easier to maintain self control when you are quite clear than hotheaded actions are not your best option under any circumstances. The knock on effect, of course, is those exhibiting self control have a calming influence and you are even less likely to face conflict in the first place.
I think this can be the case in some situations but not all.

In, for example, Jackie's daughter's situation it would appear that regardless of how things have been managed, the guy is determined to make her life a misery. How do you think it would be better managed?

Apologies for repeating myself but if I caught someone interfering with my baby I wouldn't waste time on conflict management. I don't believe many would. I fail to see how my remaining calm would prevent conflict. My baby would still be at risk and the perpetrator would wander away without a care in the world and I would have done nothing.
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