He had to track on tarmac as well - the suspects weren't always thoughtful enough to stay on the grass

I am well aware of police dog standard of tracking........

any videos of this day out ? thanks . i have kennels and train dutch herders @malis. GS AND have sold dogs to army @cops @ prison also to the u.s.a (police) but never have i started a dog young or old on tarmac even in K.N.P.V tramac and roads will come Last but would love to see this on tramac first for a few reason .I have a few good dogs that can go tracking on tramac and the likes but all started on grass and any way the police are not the bees and knees even at bite work just my view if u want to see some of my dogs u can see them on youtube k9saltire . be good be safe oh and dream but dont sleep

Sounds a really interesting experience Michael. I would be interested in group tracking sessions, but unfortunately Perth is a bit too far for me.

I started training my own dog to track by following a PD instructor's advice, as well as reading a tracking book. Then I was given the number of a local trainer and his methods were very different to any I had seen or heard about before. Needless to say, I was a bit wary and we parted company fairly shortly after.

All i can say is wow, the predjuce against the poor police, with their standard of tracking or even biting how sad, from people who I consider as being open minded and with a great deal of knowledge.

As a police dog handler and instructor, I feel a little agrieved that all police dogs are being laughed into some sub standard animal.

There are some awesome police dogs and handlers in the UK and in Scotland inparticular. True a great deal of police dogs will only reach the minimum standard required for an operational licence, this is due to the fact most police officers who work a dog are exactly that a police officer with a dog, and not a dog handler (if that makes sense).

However there are others who live and breath dog training , whos dogs are way above the required standard for a licence and who have brought in knowledge from civi trials, schutzhund, KNPV and a range of other areas.
Please dont lump all police dogs as not as good as sport dogs, there is good and bad in both, I have seen a bucket raking gift dog form a council estate stand his ground against charging football hooligans, and I have seen a Schutzhund 1 dog turn tail and run from a drunk hiding in a back garden armed with a paint brush (true).

Sorry if im being a bit defensive .

The guy that the thread is talking about is an ex dog instructor from Tayside police called Ron Anderson. The hard surface tracking i think was relating to an American website where the woman was using some cocktail of human sweat sprayed onto tarmac to train dogs???.

Although I agree with the majority grass is my prefrence for starting tracking.

There is no need to get defensive, as you say there are poor and good handlers and dogs in both the forces and sports. I know, I train with a lot of them and compete against a lot of them! And I also know quite a lot of those who supply and/or breed their dogs!

I can think of several police dog instructors and handlers who are superb and who have achieved top honours in both police and civilian trials, Mick Tustain and his WT Champion Malinois who is also an operational police dog for one.

But at the same time when top police dog handlers and international competitors such as Bernhard Flinks come over and see the standard of the police dogs and handlers presented to them, and say "your criminals must be very happy" you can see that those views are not limited to just sports competitors.

There are no spheres of competition where X is always better than Y, whether that be police v civilian, schutzhund v KNPV, Malinois v GSD

I have watched police dog trials, Security Trials, Schutzhund, Mondioring, KNPV and Working Trials so am familiar with a wide range of performances from a wide range of animals/sports.

So there is no need to feel aggrieved, any more than I would feel aggrieved if the tables were turned.

SmokeyBear, I love reading your posts, but you truely are obsessed with using the smiley!!!

Interesting stuff. I was an Army tracker dog handler in Belfast for a few years & the majority of my tasks were on hard surface in all weathers. My dog was a Gsd and was simply the bees knees to work with. Happy tracking folks

do you still have his number? I cannot pm you as I have no button for this. thanks

If anyone is interested in a tracking workshop for east central scotland I can contact the guy who trained me (he was trained by tom middlemiss).

All I can say is that (mostly) due to his training my dog has only ever missed its track twice in competition and on both occassions no other dog achieved its track (one was a UD track and we later found that a hot air baloon had landed in the field so there was fumes from the fuel everywhere and the second was a WD track in stormy conditions - you got soaked walking from car to base, 5 yards!)

Anyway, if anyone wants to PM I'll ask John, he will charge a fee, but it is likely to be low (less than a tenner)