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Shona
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20-09-2008, 04:55 PM
Originally Posted by ClaireandDaisy View Post
ah, but what`s to stop the live-in girlfriend owning one? It`s not the dog that makes the yob a criminal.
thats where things get tricky I guess, but I guess the live in girlfriend would need to walk and care for the dog,, not him, he would be breaking the law if he was on the end of the lead....
that sounds quite one sided,, some females are diddys too and use dogs as wepons so it goes both ways I guess

ETA, the hard part would be,, anyone could be put in a situation where they may find themselfs having one charge for assault... sometimes the law can get the wrong guy, so one charge for minor assault wouldnt mean you couldnt own a dog,,,,
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ClaireandDaisy
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21-09-2008, 08:41 AM
OK - hypothetical situation. Hunt Sab. wallops huntsman as his camera is being snatched. He is arrested and convicted of assault. Should he be banned from owning a dog?
I just think this is being looked at from the wrong end. I think the criminal behaviour should be stopped - and the method used (knife, dog, lead pipe) is a red herring. Banning guns hasn`t stopped criminals using them. (I am anti-gun BTW) There is a lot of abuse and cruelty involved with these dogs - but surely that is covered by the new Animal Welfare Act and the DDA?
Areas of the UK are now no-go areas and that is what`s wrong. I`d like to see the New York type Zero Tolerance policy used in the inner cities and troubled estates as that has been proved to stop it escalating.
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Shona
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21-09-2008, 10:21 AM
Originally Posted by ClaireandDaisy View Post
OK - hypothetical situation. Hunt Sab. wallops huntsman as his camera is being snatched. He is arrested and convicted of assault. Should he be banned from owning a dog?
I just think this is being looked at from the wrong end. I think the criminal behaviour should be stopped - and the method used (knife, dog, lead pipe) is a red herring. Banning guns hasn`t stopped criminals using them. (I am anti-gun BTW) There is a lot of abuse and cruelty involved with these dogs - but surely that is covered by the new Animal Welfare Act and the DDA?
Areas of the UK are now no-go areas and that is what`s wrong. I`d like to see the New York type Zero Tolerance policy used in the inner cities and troubled estates as that has been proved to stop it escalating.

As I said, in my previous post, a one off assault wouldnt ness ban you from owning a dog,

can you tell me more on the new york type thing,

what are they doing to stop dog's being used as wepons?
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ClaireandDaisy
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21-09-2008, 10:33 AM
This something that the Mayor brought in few years ago and it made a big difference apparently. Instead of ignoring the minor crimes - abusing passers-by or underage drinking for example - these misdemeanors were treated quite seriously. The idea was, I think, to not allow loutish behaviour to develop. Anytime a kids swears at an old dear on a bus and gets away with it, he or she is reinforced in the idea that nothing will happen in response to bad behaviour.
I don`t know if it`s still in force, but it did make a dramatic difference to quality of life I`m told.
It would work with dogs because it`s the intimidation that is wrong, not having the dog. The problem comes because these people are never challenged. I think the public have lost confidence in the police to protect them.
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Shona
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21-09-2008, 10:52 AM
Originally Posted by ClaireandDaisy View Post
This something that the Mayor brought in few years ago and it made a big difference apparently. Instead of ignoring the minor crimes - abusing passers-by or underage drinking for example - these misdemeanors were treated quite seriously. The idea was, I think, to not allow loutish behaviour to develop. Anytime a kids swears at an old dear on a bus and gets away with it, he or she is reinforced in the idea that nothing will happen in response to bad behaviour.
I don`t know if it`s still in force, but it did make a dramatic difference to quality of life I`m told.
It would work with dogs because it`s the intimidation that is wrong, not having the dog. The problem comes because these people are never challenged. I think the public have lost confidence in the police to protect them.
I understand what your saying, As a security company we got together with glasgow police, we run a Zero tollerance policy in our pubs.. eg.. in some pubs if you start a fight and hit someone, the bouncers will just throw you out,
In our glasgow pubs.. if you do this you will be held by security staff, untill the police arrive.. we always press charges.. It did lead to a lot of extra work on our part with court cases.. but withing six months we had more or less stopped all violence in the pubs.. It doesnt take long for people to get the idea,

the hard thing with the dog side of it would be, what is classed as intimidation with a dog?

when dougie was having his chemo.. all his hair fell out.. being 6'5" and built like a brick wall... when he walked along the road with one of the rotties.. people used to cross over and look quite worried about him... they dont really seem to do it now, so being young, having a bald head clearly made him look intimidating {well more so than he does now}
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MissE
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21-09-2008, 11:09 AM
I don't think I would see one person on their own walking a dog as intimidating.
A gang of people, yes.

I like the idea of zero tolerance and I think it should be practised. I can''t remember the last time we saw a policeman round here, before we called them out for the gang incidents.

If there is a law it should be enforced.
My first attack the teenagers had an off lead dog and the police wouldn't come out - no crime unless we're hurt
When I pointed out the laws that had been broken, I was told oh alright, we'll send a pcos. 6 months on, I'm still waiting..
when the police did come out for the second, we were told even if they found the gang members, they would be back out on the streets and the next offence may well be a murder. (ours )
We were told best walk our dog somewhere else, and best of all, move out the area.

Lost confidence in the police and justice system?
You bet.

Zero tolerance NY style might just restore it.
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Shona
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21-09-2008, 11:13 AM
A good start in this country would be to double the amount of police.. there just isnt enough of them...
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tonifletcher
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21-09-2008, 11:19 AM
i am from lpool and there aint many dangerous dogs being used as images dogs i have a rotty and a boxer and i wouldnt dream of using them as weapons its a shame because people do judge u by wot do u have and its wrong my dogs r soooooo soft espec my rotty!
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tonifletcher
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21-09-2008, 11:22 AM
i heard that there meant to be bringing out a license that u have got to obtain in order to own a dog classed as dangerous which should make it a bit harder for dogs to fall in2 the wrong hands it should be the owners put dwn for agressivness not the dogs
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Shona
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21-09-2008, 11:25 AM
Originally Posted by tonifletcher View Post
i heard that there meant to be bringing out a license that u have got to obtain in order to own a dog classed as dangerous which should make it a bit harder for dogs to fall in2 the wrong hands it should be the owners put dwn for agressivness not the dogs
I take it thats a local thing for L/pool. there are no plans in scotland for a license that I know of..
so what breeds would be classed as dangerouse under the license?
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