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Moon's Mum
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Location: SW London
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12-10-2008, 10:28 AM

Various responses to 'correction'

For those of you who don't know, I'm currently living in Vietnam and have adopted a local dog called Moon who I am now bringing back to the UK. I've started some very basic training with him i.e. sit, down, roll over.

His recall really needs work. For example, normally he won't let you out of his sight and if he runs too far away and can't see you, he'll turn around and come bck to find you. However he loves to wind up goats and cows and once he's off chasing them, he will not come back until he is ready. It's difficult to train his recall properly out here as I have no secure area I can let him off in, plus livestock distractions always pop up. And he'l be spending 6 months in quarantine very soon anyway so I guess his recall can wait until he gets out.

Anyway, I digress. My main problem is that he reacts very differently to being 'corrected' depending on the circumstances. He's been hit by his current Vietnamese owners and is clearer used to not being allowed to do anything and is always unsure.

I'm allowing him up onto my bed, but trying to make sure he only comes up when invited. One day he got over cocky, ran in and lept on the bed. I only went "Ah!" in a deep voice and the poor boy flew off the bed like he'd had an electric shock, ran all he way downstairs and out of the house and wouldn't come back in. Another time I was alking him on his lead and he lay down in a puddle to cool off, I tugged his lead slightly to twist his collar so the lead wasn't hanging in the ater and he thought it was a sign that he wasn't allowed in the puddle, he wuldn't go back in water for the whole walk.

I don't know how I can tell him what he is doing is wrong, without him completely over reacting. I try and make training as positive, reward based as possible, but even a little 'Ah' can make him run for the hills.

Having said that, if we are going down the road and we see cows, he'll run after them. If I warn him not to go, or call after him, it makes no difference. This 'meekness' disappears completely when e's focused on chasing them and I think I could scream a him like a raving looney (of course, I haven't) and he probably wouldn't care. He will not come back when he runs after live stock. I've found the easiest way is to ignore him, and he usually comes back quickly.

So I'm not sure how to handle this. Sometimes he completely over reacts because he loves to please me and is upset if he does wrong, other times he couldn't care that I'm unhappy with what he's doing (usually chasing livestock). Any thoughts?

p.s. we will of course be taking him to proper traning clases when he gets back to the UK, but thats a long way of, especially with 6 months quarantine to go.
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maxine
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12-10-2008, 07:26 PM
Hi Moon's mother

The chasing of livestock issue could be a real headache for you in the UK. If you will be living in a livestock-free area then fine, but UK farmers will take a very dim view of your dog "winding up" their stock, and the law is on their side. Stock fencing will not impede a determined dog, so unless you intend to exercise your dog on the lead or in parks you will need to be very careful.

Best wishes

Maxine
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Hali
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12-10-2008, 07:53 PM
Time will be the thing that works best with Moon understanding that even when you're telling him off, it's not the end of the world. My most recent rescue was similar - the smallest of things would send her running, but she has come on no end in the past few months.

As for the recall bit, I think there are 2 issues (1) Moon has probably realised that when he's off like that, no-one can reach him to punish him and (2) its a real fun thing for him to do as it would seem he has a high prey drive.

Prey drive can be controlled by giving Moon another outlet for his chase instincts; e.g. will he play with a ball?

Working on the commands 'leave' and 'stay' will be worthwhile and you can work up gradually to situations which require greater control. For example, I can lob a ball and make my older rescue wait until I say she can get it, but I'm still working up to that with my most recent one.

Good luck
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Moon's Mum
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15-10-2008, 05:23 AM
Hi, thanks for the responses. Luckily I will be living in London with him so he'll mostly come across squirells and cats. He shows no desire to chase either out here, he just seems to like annoying really big cows. I doubt he'll come across cows too often and of course he'll be on a lead if I think we will. naturally I'll still need to work on his recall.

He's actually terrified of balls! He runs away from them. He will however chase and retried a rope tug toy sometimes, but only when he's in the mood...
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catrinsparkles
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15-10-2008, 07:19 AM
Personally i would change it round and rather than "correcting him" by making aahah noises etc i would give him a counter command e.g, when he is on the bed, walk away from the bed, call him and get him to sit, then you can reward him. He should soon learn that it isn't worth getting on the bed uninvited as he will have to get off.....and the bedroom door gets shut.

I prefer this approach with most dogs particularly with a dog who has has bad experiences of correction, and puppies.

Good luck with him.
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Ben Mcfuzzylugs
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15-10-2008, 09:25 AM
awww sounds a lot like my guy
In many ways I really like that he is so 'soft' cos I have to work on thinking how to teach positivly
I think if he has bad associations with ahhhhahh then stop using it
I like having a non reward noise, how about 'try again' and then when he does something you dont want you say that (in a nice voice) and teach him what you want him to do

As for the recal - plenty dogs having fun turn a totaly deaf ear, I can always tell by Bens tail positon and ear position (both wayyyy up in the air) when he has his whheeeeee head on and is having far to much fun
It is possible to work through that so YOU are even more fun than the thing they are doing - and you are doing the right thing training and building the bond

Best of luck - 6 months is going to be hard for both of you
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Wysiwyg
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16-10-2008, 07:44 AM
Originally Posted by catrinsparkles View Post
Personally i would change it round and rather than "correcting him" by making aahah noises etc i would give him a counter command e.g, when he is on the bed, walk away from the bed, call him and get him to sit, then you can reward him. He should soon learn that it isn't worth getting on the bed uninvited as he will have to get off.....and the bedroom door gets shut.

I prefer this approach with most dogs particularly with a dog who has has bad experiences of correction, and puppies.

Good luck with him.
Well said. I very rarely if ever tell a dog off because I prefer to use this way...works very well and you have a confident, obedient dog and a great relationship at the end of the day.


I'm allowing him up onto my bed, but trying to make sure he only comes up when invited. One day he got over cocky, ran in and lept on the bed.

He probably started to trust you, rather than got cocky.
If you train dogs generally, eg sit for dinner, sit for lead on, etc they tend to get into the habit of "asking" but you can't expect the dog you've got now to respond like that just yet although with time and patience he may do in the future.

If I didn't want a dog to leap on the bed without being allowed first, and the dog jumped on, I'd tend to say gently "off" and then ask for a sit and then say "Ok, hup!" which also instructs the dog what you prefer...and you can reward for that too

Re chasing, I often put a link to this site, it's got some very helpful info on it generally and particularly about chasing:

http://www.dog-secrets.co.uk/behaviour--training/
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catrinsparkles
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16-10-2008, 07:55 AM
Originally Posted by Wysiwyg View Post
Well said. I very rarely if ever tell a dog off because I prefer to use this way...works very well and you have a confident, obedient dog and a great relationship at the end of the day.


I'm allowing him up onto my bed, but trying to make sure he only comes up when invited. One day he got over cocky, ran in and lept on the bed.

He probably started to trust you, rather than got cocky.
If you train dogs generally, eg sit for dinner, sit for lead on, etc they tend to get into the habit of "asking" but you can't expect the dog you've got now to respond like that just yet although with time and patience he may do in the future.

If I didn't want a dog to leap on the bed without being allowed first, and the dog jumped on, I'd tend to say gently "off" and then ask for a sit and then say "Ok, hup!" which also instructs the dog what you prefer...and you can reward for that too

Re chasing, I often put a link to this site, it's got some very helpful info on it generally and particularly about chasing:

http://www.dog-secrets.co.uk/behaviour--training/

Hello, is that your webiste?
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Wysiwyg
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17-10-2008, 08:36 AM
Hi, no it's not mine, I'd love to have his experience and his qualifications though!
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