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Fivedogpam
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Location: Worcester, United Kingdom
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03-06-2013, 06:59 AM
I have pedigree border collies because it means I have done all that I can to avoid any inherited conditions as they are all health-tested. I also do agility and they are the best breed for the sport.

I usually have my dogs and bitches neutered around 6-8 months and have never had any problems. However, Jack is now 19 months and still entire because he had quite a traumatic time last year with a chipped bone, and losing two of my older dogs - which affected me badly and consequently the other dogs as well. So I decided he had had enough to contend with, plus he is barely even cocking his leg and not displaying any of the more negative symptoms of 'bitching'.

I probably will get him castrated at some point because I have known many people whose dogs have had problems such as prostate cancer and bitches with pyometra but not yet - perhaps next winter when the agility season is quiet.
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Magic
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11-06-2013, 04:02 PM
Spay/Neuter is for population control (and convenience for owners), and not to mention, keeps the veterinary practice well employed. Period. Not for health benefits for the animals (unless a diagnosed medical condition has merit for the procedure).

I've had plenty of dogs (mostly all entire), read a few papers and studies, and read the odd debate here and there. People ought to educate themselves when they have responsibility for an animal, and not just swallow and regurgitate what's popularly thrown about (including that from the vet profession). My 2p
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Jackie
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11-06-2013, 04:43 PM
Originally Posted by mjfromga View Post
, I don't get the appeal of expensive pure bred dogs, except in the event that the owners plan to breed, show, or otherwise use the dogs to make money.

You may not " get it " but thousands of people do, there sounds like a bit of inverted snobbery hidden in that statement I think .

The appeal of a purebred is that the person buying it knows exactly what they are getting, size, characteristics , whether it will fit into your lifestyle, and if bought from a reputable breeder, the health / temperament of its parents g/parents and so on.

Unlike when you take on a rescue or a mutt, it's all guess work, but each to their own.

I get why some folk prefer crossbreeds and mutts, and I get why some folk prefer purebred s, it's not a mystery really is it .....it's called choice.
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Pysces
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11-06-2013, 04:46 PM
We had Jake neutered shortly after the police said we could keep him as our other dog, Boots, wasn't spayed. Boots technically belonged to my FIL and he didn't "believe in the operation" so she was never done. She died aged 11 from a Malignant Melanoma, which wasn't related to her being entire.

I think Jake was done too young (we have no real idea how old Jake is as he was a stray). He has so many fears, phobia's and foibles which all seemed to be acerbated after his "snip".

Jasper hasn't been done, he isn't a sex pest but he is very timid and insecure and I think neutering him would make that worse.
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Jackie
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11-06-2013, 04:52 PM
Regarding spay and neuter, it's down to in individual choice, as long as the dog in question has been allowed to mature first, sadly we seem to be following the US school of thought, more and more, chop their bits off as soon as possible.
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catrinsparkles
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11-06-2013, 04:55 PM
Originally Posted by Pysces View Post
We had Jake neutered shortly after the police said we could keep him as our other dog, Boots, wasn't spayed. Boots technically belonged to my FIL and he didn't "believe in the operation" so she was never done. She died aged 11 from a Malignant Melanoma, which wasn't related to her being entire.

I think Jake was done too young (we have no real idea how old Jake is as he was a stray). He has so many fears, phobia's and foibles which all seemed to be acerbated after his "snip".

Jasper hasn't been done, he isn't a sex pest but he is very timid and insecure and I think neutering him would make that worse.
It can make nervous dogs much worse and I was just reading the precastration leaflet from our vets and was glad to see that they advise you to speak to them or a behaviourist first if you have an aggressive or nervous dog.
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anonymousone
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11-06-2013, 06:29 PM
Read a book, if you get the chance from a proffesional Bruce fogle DVM, MRCVS, vet and international lecturer. Good insight into castration. And peoples misconceptions.
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Mattie
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11-06-2013, 09:07 PM
I will always have a bitch spayed but not until she has had a season, with a large breed dog like a Rottie she would have several seasons.

My reasons, spaying is the equivalent of a hysterectomy in us, major invasive surgery, dogs do recover quicker than we do but it is still major invasive surgery.

I find that a bitch matures a lot during her first season, she goes into it as pup, comes out as an adult, this has happened with every bitch I have had apart from the oldies I have taken on. The bitches that were spayed as pups before they came to me, never matured mentally, they had a puppy mentality to when they went to the Rainbow Bridge. One lived until she was 17.5 years old and was a pup to the end

Spaying doesn't stop pyrometer, a bitch can still get the infection but it I rare, a lot more common in a bitch that hasn't been spayed and it is life threatening, many die.

Mammary cancer is another health issue that spaying reduces greatly, again it is life threatening.

With dogs I wouldn't get them neutered unless there was a good reason to, neutering swops one the high risks of one cancer for another.

For both, neutering a nervous dog before they reach maturity can make the nervousness a lot worse, dogs need their hormones to help them become more confident. We read about dogs that vets have recommended being neutered because of aggression, in many cases the aggression doesn't improve and in many the aggression gets worse, I haven't see anyone say that their dog's aggression got better but there must be some.

The growth plates are late in closing, this means the dog grows taller than they should, this is also linked to bone cancer in some breeds.

I can understand bitches being spayed as it stops them having pups but dogs don't have pups, it is impossible, they can cause a bitch to have pups but if she is spayed she can't.
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Rosebud77
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13-06-2013, 07:50 AM
Family who are top breeders in Canada advocate juvenile neutering in males to prevent hormone memory; ie before the testosterone is produced. Prevents male aggression and is easier on the dog. It is the norm over there.

Once bought in a new cockerel as the old one was waning He was a pet, followed me everywhere , on my lap to be petted, until one day in spring his testosterone came in. He became immediately an aggressive ankle pecker. Almost killed the old cockerel and even a bucket of water did nothing.... I always think of them when this subject comes up...Never underestimate the power of hormones and in dogs they linger on for months and their effect on nature and behaviour can be permanent, Early neutering works. Ditto juvenile spaying for bitches for many reasons well discussed here. It is also a less traumatic procedure done early.
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Anniebee
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13-06-2013, 09:20 AM
Originally Posted by Rosebud77 View Post
Family who are top breeders in Canada advocate juvenile neutering in males to prevent hormone memory; ie before the testosterone is produced. Prevents male aggression and is easier on the dog. It is the norm over there.

Once bought in a new cockerel as the old one was waning He was a pet, followed me everywhere , on my lap to be petted, until one day in spring his testosterone came in. He became immediately an aggressive ankle pecker. Almost killed the old cockerel and even a bucket of water did nothing.... I always think of them when this subject comes up...Never underestimate the power of hormones and in dogs they linger on for months and their effect on nature and behaviour can be permanent, Early neutering works. Ditto juvenile spaying for bitches for many reasons well discussed here. It is also a less traumatic procedure done early.
Cockerels are not dogs so not sure that's a valid comparison at all.

All hormones are needed for growth and maturation, so removing those hormones has to have a negative effect.

My experience with meeting dogs that have been neutered at under six months is that my entire male wants to hump them all the time, they seem to give off some kind of aroma that makes that particularly attractive to entire dogs, not just mine.

I meet one owner who berates herself all the time for letting her vet neuter her dog at 5 months old because walking him is a nightmare for her as he's constantly being humped.
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