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Ali
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25-04-2007, 02:58 PM
If there is fear aggression there surely the trainer/instructor should be aware of it. I know that when I take Obi into the class my instructor nicely reminds everyone (every week!) that he is fearful and that it is everyones responsibility including mine to ensure that no negative incidents occur. She does not make the other dogs and owners keep away from him but we are slowly socialising him at a distance he is comfortable with we can now sit about 2 foot away and hold a conversation but still not let sniffing occur, and the whole class are aware of this and are helping with this.

I know when he will kick off and I take responsibility for managing the situation and if it really was the other owners at fault they will be told so by the instructor.

What im saying is that YOU need to take responsibility of the situation. No one else can and no one knows you dog like you you owe it to her to get the problem sorted out.
Moobli
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25-04-2007, 03:16 PM
Originally Posted by bribiba View Post
I find it very disturbing that someone has bred a 'young pup' with such a temperament this is where the problem stems from...it is time the government got its act together and stopped backyard breeding.
Hmm - a young pup can become easily scared and show this through fear aggression ... having little or nothing to do with breeding.
Moobli
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25-04-2007, 03:21 PM
Originally Posted by Westie_N View Post
I, too, first thought it could be fear aggression, however, I agree with you that young puppies usually take the flight option when it comes to them being frightened.

Now, personally, I think Millie just needs put in her place, she needs to learn submission, I think.

I'm beginning to believe that Millie's upbringing is causing her to become aggressive, sounds to me like Millie is never told "no" and is quite a bossy dog and that the owner believes Millie is always in the right.
There are an awful lot of assumptions in this post, which I think is very dangerous!

A young pup's reaction to a threat may well be flight, but what if flight isn't an option? ie all dogs are on lead??
Moobli
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25-04-2007, 03:24 PM
Originally Posted by Ali View Post
If there is fear aggression there surely the trainer/instructor should be aware of it. I know that when I take Obi into the class my instructor nicely reminds everyone (every week!) that he is fearful and that it is everyones responsibility including mine to ensure that no negative incidents occur. She does not make the other dogs and owners keep away from him but we are slowly socialising him at a distance he is comfortable with we can now sit about 2 foot away and hold a conversation but still not let sniffing occur, and the whole class are aware of this and are helping with this.

I know when he will kick off and I take responsibility for managing the situation and if it really was the other owners at fault they will be told so by the instructor.

What im saying is that YOU need to take responsibility of the situation. No one else can and no one knows you dog like you you owe it to her to get the problem sorted out.

Perhaps I am reading the whole situation wrongly - but it seems to me that Suze had no idea Millie was going to react in the way she did ???

Suze??

I think perhaps the whole thing is being taken out of context and over-dramatised now?
bribiba
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25-04-2007, 03:28 PM
Yes what I meant to say was...'if this is where the problem stems from'...but I do feel that it is all to easy for ignorant people to be able to breed.
As a dog trainer of some 30 years + I do know about fear aggression, at the end of the day though any dog that behaves like that is not one I would like as a pet no matter what age it was and no matter how scared my puppy's are they NEVER attack.

Originally Posted by Moobli View Post
Hmm - a young pup can become easily scared and show this through fear aggression ... having little or nothing to do with breeding.
Westie_N
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25-04-2007, 04:06 PM
Originally Posted by Moobli View Post
There are an awful lot of assumptions in this post, which I think is very dangerous!

A young pup's reaction to a threat may well be flight, but what if flight isn't an option? ie all dogs are on lead??
From the reactions of the owner of Millie, this is what I am picking up from her....

I hope she will inform me otherwise, but I don't think that'll be the case...

Obviously, the owner has a lot of input into how the dog behaves, aswell as the breeding.
Shona
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25-04-2007, 04:42 PM
Originally Posted by Moobli View Post
There are an awful lot of assumptions in this post, which I think is very dangerous!

A young pup's reaction to a threat may well be flight, but what if flight isn't an option? ie all dogs are on lead??

Hi Moobli, the way i read it was the dog sniffed and quote from suze [she just went for it and I mean really went for it]
there is no indication that the dog tried to move away from the lab, hence my asking was the dog under a chair at the time, poss the chair being against a wall, then she would have no where to go, but if not she is just being nippy and needs told off
bribiba
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25-04-2007, 04:56 PM
Yes of course the owner has a lot of input, but as a breeder I would never sell a puppy to someone then leave them to it. I am always available 24/7 to make sure that my dogs and owners get the best I can give. That is what all breeders should be doing. How many of you have asked your breeder for help and advice and got nothing as soon as the pup was paid for?
I know there are lots of great breeders who care out in this world, but there are many more who don't.
If this was one of my pups behaving in this way I would be very concerned.
Originally Posted by Westie_N View Post
From the reactions of the owner of Millie, this is what I am picking up from her....

I hope she will inform me otherwise, but I don't think that'll be the case...

Obviously, the owner has a lot of input into how the dog behaves, aswell as the breeding.
Westie_N
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25-04-2007, 04:59 PM
Originally Posted by bribiba View Post
Yes of course the owner has a lot of input, but as a breeder I would never sell a puppy to someone then leave them to it. I am always available 24/7 to make sure that my dogs and owners get the best I can give. That is what all breeders should be doing. How many of you have asked your breeder for help and advice and got nothing as soon as the pup was paid for?
I know there are lots of great breeders who care out in this world, but there are many more who don't.
If this was one of my pups behaving in this way I would be very concerned.
Oh, I wholeheartedly agree with you Bribiba, I wasn't criticising at all.

It seems that you are a very reputable breeder, I was only saying in addition to breeding, the owner has a lot to do with how a dog behaves.
Westie_N
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25-04-2007, 05:01 PM
I've never had to contact my Westie's breeder.

She is a fantastic wee dog and I only wish that we were able to take her sister aswell!
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