aggressive (dog-aggressive bitch. Fear-aggression?)

hi i have new neighbour with a very dog aggressive gsd bitch.we have been working on the walk past without growling and barking,sit,down etc floss is fine with it now but the other dog shows no signs of giving in.she has allsorts of probs she became aggressive after windows were broken in her last house whilst she was in there.so i think it is all based on fear and protection???anyway after a few near misses with mine and other sogs i advises the owner to buy a muzzle so she can try and socialise and train the dog without fear.owner has been doing all the stop the dog thinking she is alpha things in the house but get hre outside and she becomes the devil dog around other dogs(bitches in particular).the owner youngish girl has no!control over the dog at all partly as the dog is so strong and partly as she isnt firm enough with it IMHO.can anyone suggest a training programme for the owner and dog that i can help her with?i havent really got any experience of dog aggressive dogs or 1s that lunge at any visitors????oh and not to mention its hatred of cats!which is worrying as i have 3cats!thankyou in advance i look forward to reading any hints.PLease!

ooops forgot to say thankyou aswell!!

Hiya,

The obvious answer is to find a good behaviourist (preferably recommended) as its hard to comment without seeing the dog.

Fear aggression is a hard thing to solve (imo it can't be solved but can be made easier and the dogs confidence built up to make the situation manageable).

A GSD is a big and powerful dog and if the owner has difficulty controlling the dog due to pure strength I would suggest the use of a training aid such as a canny collar that will give her more control. From what you have said the basic control of this dog isn't that good - so that would be where I would start. One of the hardest things to do is to get a fearful dog to accept that you (the handler) will deal with any situation that arises, therefore there is no need to be afraid. How can that possibly happen if the owner cannot control the dog under normal circumstances? Sit, Down, Come and Leave are all invaluable commands - and for working with this sort of problem i've found a "settle" command can also be invaluable as can "watch", all these things take time, patience and consistency to teach. But fear aggression is not something that can be solved overnight, it takes years.

Due to lack of control for the dog and owners and the publics protection this dog should be muzzled when taken outside.

If you're back yards arent completely seperated ie. not able to see each other at all. Then i'd recommend doing this - the last thing you need is for your dog to become fearful as well.

As I said its hard to comment, but until more control in general is gained I would keep the dog muzzled and on an extendable lead during exercise as well as avoiding other dogs. Muzzling the dog and forcing it into a "socialising" situation will do so much more harm than good. Once the control has been gained the dogs should be stood at the dogs comfort zone - this can be massive (on the horizon even) and any positive or neutral reaction rewarded - don't reward for avoiding the other dog, all that teaches is avoiding the situation - then when the dog does find itself in the situation it can't handle it and it's back to square one.

I'm going to shut up now because you might just think i'm rambling rubbish. I'm just talking from the experience i've had with my own dog and helping several other people with training but i'm far from a behaviourist or knowing how to solve all problems.

As I said at the beginning finding a reputable behaviourist to help is the best bet, as noone in here can give any advice specific to the dog without seeing it. If the owner isn't prepared to put in the work and effort (financially, physically and most importantly emotionally) it would be kinder to all to rehome the dog.

Good luck and please feel free to PM for a chat or a vent at any time - I know how hard the situation can be.

H xx

This is not intended to come across as rude, but are you a qualified dog behaviourist? If not, I would suggest that the most sensible and responsible thing to do would be to suggest that your neighbour consults with her vet and gets referred to a behaviourist that they recommend

Dog aggression, as you probably know, comes in many different flavours with many different triggers. During their consultation a behaviourist will be able to ask your neighbour a lot of questions about the dog and different situations it might be in (some of which your neighbour may feel are a little irrelevant, but are not, they build up a complete picture of the animal - they will then want to observe the dog first hand to look at the behaviour in question, diagnose, and then suggest a course of therapy with the owner

In the nicest possible way, I think you are treading on very dangerous ground by attempting to work through the situation with your neighbour

Also, when the vet recommends a behaviourist, ask your neighbour to check the credentials with their vet, and ask why they are recommending that particular person

Get your neighbour to have a thorough converstaion with them first, asking to what extent they have worked with aggressive dogs, and, more importantly, the successes they have had, ask about their qualifications and methods (no point paying for them to come round if they don't feel they will get on with their training methods!), and if possible talk to more than one before booking an appt

As per previous post, sorry to ramble, but think it's important!

Good luck to your neighbour!

It is an unfortunate fact that some bitches are bitch aggressive, often made worse by spaying, there is not a lot you can do about this sort of aggression.

If your neighbour can afford or is insured I would suggest that they take the bitch to the vet for a check up to make sure there is not a medical problem and if the medical examination and tests proves ok then ask the vet for a referral to a behaviourist who will have stooge dogs and bitches to introduce to the bitch and from her reaction the behaviourist should be able to work out a routine to help reduce this behaviour. It is not a good idea to try and sort it yourselves someone of a dog could get hurt.

I didn't know that - what is the reason behind this?

About the spaying exacerbating the problem I mean!

Sometimes removing the female hormones causing an already aggressive bitch to loose feminine control and become more aggressive, sometime it does not. Neutering is not a confirmed science and IMO should not be used to cure problems that could be dealt with by training or control.

thanks for your replies if it was me i would consult a behaviourist but i know they have no money and couldnt afford to do that,the daughter is a student aswell,the dog is now muzzled when out and i have done some research and used some of my experience re the listening to commands and she is working on that and since she has learnt to say it like she means it,is getting somewhere.she does genuinely(spelt?) seem to want to cure this and is working hard with her.could a canny collar or similar be used under the muzzle then?the bitch isnt neutered and i had read somewhere that if a bitvh shows aggression before puberty the speying it would make it worse,but wasnt sure with this 1 as it is fairly recent behaviour approx 1 yr, before that she was fine.thanks again

I understand what you're saying and I would still have a chat with the vet - not all behaviourists cost the earth - the most expensive by no means guarantees the best, in fact on another thread on here the topic was covered and one dog webber said that the behaviourist only charged about £20 per hour - also ring some dog rescue places, large and small establishments and explain the predicament - if I were a behaviourist I would certainly not turn away a distressed client with a problem purely on the basis that they were not well off - anyone prepared to walk away from someone with an aggressive dog who is trying to get help purely on the basis that they're not rolling in money is somewhat greedy and only interested in their own gain in my book - see how you get on!