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Call for ban on electric shock collars

...has received 236 comments (page 4)
gordon mac
Dogsey Veteran
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 4,011
Male 
 
13-01-2015, 09:57 PM
Gnasher - given your circumstances, I have no doubt at all that you did the right thing. Fortunately I have never found myself in that position and dearly hope i never do. Will say however, there really are some clever b*ggers on this thread. Just wish that i had one tenth of their skill with dogs. Would write a book and put my feet up in the sun on the inevitable proceeds that such a wise tome would doubtless produce!
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Chris
Dogsey Veteran
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 8,921
Female 
 
13-01-2015, 09:57 PM
As usual, we will have to agree to disagree, Gnasher.

Your mind is made up, as is mine and I don't think any amount of debate will change either of our minds
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mjfromga
Dogsey Veteran
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 5,680
Female 
 
14-01-2015, 02:06 AM
I'm with bugly. As a last resort, I might use one and I hate them too. I've seen them used where the dogs didn't seem to be in any pain and responded well. If you didn't see the e collar you'd not have known it was there. They are widely misused and they are often used by lazy owners instead of last resort like I think they should be. But I can't say that I'd never use one, no matter what. That, I think is pure arrogance and vanity.
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Gnasher
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 8,775
Female 
 
14-01-2015, 09:22 AM
Thank you Gordon, I appreciate that.

Chris, as your mind is made up then there is no point continuing. It is a great shame though that you are not big enough, like others on this thread, to admit that you would resort to the use of an e collar if the Only alternative was euthanasia. A beautiful bouncing norty 45 kilos of loveable roguish Ben, being put to sleep, dying in my arms for no reason whatsoever other than I was too wet to have the balls to give him 2 little nicks which feel like flea bites at worse.

Frankly if you are telling me the truth - and as a dog lover I just don't think you are - then clearly you are not the person I thought you to be. I am disgusted. However, I choose to think that you are lying because you don't want to admit that in certain very extreme circumstances an e collar can be the last chance for a dog.

Myra, Gordon, Lacey and others who I may have overlooked are all big enough to agree that it is possible I had no choice ...

I hope that one day my words don't come to haunt you. With all our beloved animals we should never say never. Not if we truly care for them as we profess we do.
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Chris
Dogsey Veteran
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 8,921
Female 
 
14-01-2015, 12:47 PM
Where I agree to disagree, Gnasher, is that I am 'big enough' to know that there are many alternatives to the use of e-collars and your argument of 'last resort to euthanasia' is nothing more than myth.

What disgusts me are owners who would resort to physical means to force a dog into doing what they want. Every time you have used the e-collar for a problem, Gnasher, you have implied that it has been as a last resort to euthanasia. Ben's life seems to have had a number of perils
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Meg
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 49,483
Female  Diamond Supporter 
 
14-01-2015, 01:09 PM
I have entered many debates on e collars and feel I have said just about all there is to say.
If the day ever came that I felt the need to resort to torturing a dog in order to train or handle it, that is the day I would give up owning dogs .
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mjfromga
Dogsey Veteran
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 5,680
Female 
 
14-01-2015, 01:12 PM
You're missing the point. She didn't force Ben to do what she wanted. It was for a serious health problem, it was not for training, and it worked. The dog likely did not suffer any ill effects and even if you could have worked it out without the collar (not sure you could), she could not and she did what she thought was best, and it was done out of love. I have not heard her mention the collar for other reasons.

If I felt cornered I'd consider it too, and I dislike those collars and have never once even put my hand on one. You are claiming that in no circumstances could an e collar ever be a lifesaver for a dog. I'm really not sure how one can even stand by that conviction. Gosh it's certainly not true here in the usa
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sandgrubber
Dogsey Junior
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 154
Female 
 
14-01-2015, 02:29 PM
Meg, you have a strange definition of torture. Many many owners keep their dogs in solitary confinement with very little interaction, exercise, or stimulation of any sort. How about getting vocal to ban neglect, ie., the most common form of dog torture.

If you have never put an e-collar on yourself and tried tuning it to low stimulus, you don't know what you are talking about when you damn the e-collar as cruel. If you've never watched a dog working with a good trainer and a properly calibrated collar, you are out-of-line to condemn. I gave away my e-collar, not because it was cruel -- my dogs were enthusiastic about having it put on because they liked training with it (though they freaked out when I hit the vibrate rather than the stim function), but because I don't see the need to recharge batteries, use special collars, and all the other fuss that goes along with e-collar use.
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Azz
Administrator
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 18,574
Male 
 
14-01-2015, 02:45 PM
Electric shocks are not just physical, but mental abuse - and that is the mechanism that makes them effective. The dog is constantly anxious about pain - and where it might come from or what might trigger it. If it associates the pain with something (or a number of things) e.g. playing roughly AND in the presence of owner (remember they can smell you!) and one thing is removed, the dog could well seek to eliminate the other factor (which could be a child or another dog, were that the case). I haven't heard of a single case where electric shock collars are acceptable (apart from maybe being used on people who think they are ok to use on dogs!!)

With regards to this comment by Gnasher:

No if's, and's or buts ... we had no choice, everything we had tried failed. A couple of nicks or death? It was a no brainer and anyone who says otherwise is frankly talking through their *********.
How about one of these:



Or one of them in conjunction with staying at home and monitoring your dog while he is poorly - and getting the dog checked out when unusual behaviour such as what you describe begins.
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Meg
Supervisor
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 49,483
Female  Diamond Supporter 
 
14-01-2015, 03:02 PM
Originally Posted by Sandgrubber
Meg, you have a strange definition of torture. Many many owners keep their dogs in solitary confinement with very little interaction, exercise, or stimulation of any sort. How about getting vocal to ban neglect, ie., the most common form of dog torture.

If you have never put an e-collar on yourself and tried tuning it to low stimulus, you don't know what you are talking about when you damn the e-collar as cruel. If you've never watched a dog working with a good trainer and a properly calibrated collar, you are out-of-line to condemn. I gave away my e-collar, not because it was cruel -- my dogs were enthusiastic about having it put on because they liked training with it (though they freaked out when I hit the vibrate rather than the stim function), but because I don't see the need to recharge batteries, use special collars, and all the other fuss that goes along with e-collar use.
sandgrubber
SG Some dogs being badly treated in a number of ways by their owners is no justification for other owners to torture their dog with an ecollar. All ill treatment of dogs is wrong, if you can't keep a dog without inflicting pain don't have one.
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