Opinons wanted on the use of corrections in Gundog training

If this is in the wrong area then I apologise, but I couldnt think of anywhere else it would go ...

Ok Pretend this is you … you’ve joined a new club and know that it specializes in Gundog work.

You know your dog runs in on a walk up, so normally it has the lead draped round its neck, so that when it does come to the dogs turn all it takes is the finger to be released and the dog can run in on it’s turn fine. But you know there has to come the day that you will have to have the dog sitting at your side with no lead. If the dog does run in typically for a correction you intercept the dog and growl at it, but not allowing it to retrieve the dummy as that would be the reward for running in. What would you expect your trainer to do .. (Trainer is halfway between you and the dummy thrower)

1 Run in toward the dog and say in a sharp voice No, sending it back.

2 Run in toward the dog looking very threatening (not touching it) growling a lot using a lot of ‘What are you doing’ in a very low voice, once again sending it back.

3 Run in growling, taking the dog by the scruff , shaking it (front paws are off the floor) looking directly in it’s eyes and dragging it about 2 yards whilst still telling it off, Then releasing it. It’s over in a matter of 5 seconds. Short and sharp being the tactic.

If the trainer did number 3 how would react and why ?

well I'm not a member of any gundog training but no matter what training I was doing with my dog if ANY-ONE handled my dog like that I would go over and do the human equivelant to them

did this happen to you?

it makes me angry just reading it that any-one could do this to an animal

the reason I would be against it is you cannot and should not train your dog using fear - speak to amts she does brilliant training her dog to do gundog stuff

Thanks Emm ..

Unfortunately it did happen yesterday .. what wound me up the most was the fact that the liberty was taken in manhandling my dog with out my permisson My dog is ok though.

Its a Long Story, that I dont really want to go into on here, but if anyone is interested pm me and I'll tell you what happnened.

OMG that's terrible! That's no way to treat a dog and one way to dispell all confidence he had in the first place! If I was you I'd report him! In fact if I was you I'd probably have grabbed the trainer by the scruff and see how he liked it!

Thats dreadful,if a human did that to another human it would be classed as assault,why do some people think it is ok to treat a dog in that way.

I would say 1

If 3 happened to my dog... I would be very very angry.. But as I'm a chicken when it comes to confrontations, I would probablely just take my dog and leave... and never come back...

So sorry you've experienced this

well i would go up the wall, people like that can't call themselfs trainers if thats what they have to resort to with any dog.

I would expect the trainer to do nothing at all, its the trainers job to point you in the right direction and not take control of "YOUR" dog except in the initial stages of training where it may be the case they demonstrate a point to you.
You are the handler and, apart form being the owner, and corrections are soley your responsibility.

I would take this up with some one higher if there is one, if there are witness's ask them if they would colloborate any complaint you make.

We live in enlightened times when positive training is the way, physically correcting dogs is in my view the mark of some one who is defenately following the wrong vocation.

A trainer who resorts to physical correction has failed, end of story.

The other problem is that through training, you are building up a relationship with your dog, part of that is your dog developing trust in you and looking to you for guidance, whether its correction or praise, some one else steps in and plants uncertainty in your dogs mind I'd have gone ballistic.

If anyone manhandled my dog in such a manner, I dont think that I would be responsible for my actions, I would neither treat my dogs, or anyone elses in this manner, and would not expect anyone to abuse my dog in the way you mentioned.

I would certainly make a formal complaint to the clib, and I would be looking around for another club!

You do? Can I ask why? (Out of curiosity - nothing else )

I´m sorry to hear your trainer has been a jerk. I would expect mine to do none of the above.
IMO its me who has to teach my dog that it cant run off, disobey, do what it pleases, etc.
IRL you wont have a trainer or a helper who can correct your dog for bad behavior.
The dog needs to know that even at distances, you are the one who calls the shots (maybe bad choice of words, but you get it right ).

You can pm me if you want to tell the story Willow. I´ll be back on here saturday or sunday