??? what genetic fact ?????


It is a fact that in a "group"of stray dogs, the most aggressive male is the main stud & he will mate any in season bitch, including his own mother, sister, daughter etc etc

In Hull there is a"Hull"mongrel"black & tan in colour & in various sizes from BC to Corgi. How do I know ? because I saw them all over the city & they were all prick eared & medium coated. I had one of these mongrels(not a simple X breed as she was obviously a mongrel-my vet tried to say she was a GSD x BC yer right she was 14 inches tall)She had the worse Hips I have ever seen-53:53=106, she was unilaterally deaf & had sight problems, she was also excessively nervous. The product of many years of random unsupervised breeding

We had a spaniel type Mongrel that had severe epilepsy & a terrier type mongrel that had the most unpredictable temperament-but he was a good ratter.

The last type I was at the Vets(with new puppy)it was packed-two sort of labradors & the rest all mongrels probably over a dozen dogs.& my current vet certainly sees more mongrels/crossbreeds with health problems than pedigrees & the practice is in a country town-not an inner city.

The GP do not do DNA or clinical health tests on their mongrels before allowing them to breed, so who is to know what recessive/dominant conditions they carry, especially if the conditions are non life threatening ?

There are lots but here are a few :
- Polycystic Kidney Disease
- Congenital Laryngeal Paralysis
- Alport Syndrome
- Hereditary Canine Spinal Muscular Atrophy

Surely any Autosomal Dominant disorders or Sex linked disorders would be passed to offspring regardless of them being pedigrees or crosses?

Thank you for pointing out my confussion... you obvioulsy can read my mind giving you the insight to know what I say , is not what I mean!


The above was meant as it states, as in the fact that genetics will and can play a negative role in ALL dogs regardless of Ped v Xbreed



But in percentages it will probably be nearer the thruth!!

yes there is a chance that you will not double up on problem genes, but there is also a chance you will double up, it has to go both ways, the problem being, you really dont know what possible problem genes any two x breeds may have, to an extent you know with pedigree dogs what "breed related" issues you may have, some can be tested for, some will be found dna markers for I hope,
its a catch 22 situation. there are pro's and con's in both

Genetic principles apply to populations. When we talk of populations in statistical terms it precludes the anecdotal exceptions, (ie everyone's examples on here as the measure is statistical probability). Yes, isolated populations provide different data, as do populations that are manipulated (pre zygotic selection by breeders).

The main problem with answers on the thread is that people are not differentiating between the two and are confusing the concept of genetic diversity with anecdotal examples. I would also differentiate between cross breed and mixed breed. The longevity data would apply to mixed breeds of several generations, not just an F1 cross and esp not one that goes on to be inbred.

I have a long-lived mongrel...and have had others live to 19/20. Very healthy too, but the example is irrelevant!!!

If you go to countries with stray dogs breeding, the dogs are not healthy. I know this may well be due to the terrible life they lead, but they don`t, even when young, appear to be wonderful animals.
Most well-bred dogs are healthy (emphasis on well bred). Most cross breeds these days are not - as previously - true mongrels even but first or second crosses from `pedigree` dogs.
Since the breeding of dogs has been under human control for such a long time, I think the cross / pedigree debate is pointless. All dogs have, at some point, been deliberately bred. The question for me is - would outcrossing some breeds improve them?

It's only reading this thread that I realise I have absolutely no idea about the health of crossbreeds. I have never owned one or don't know anybody with one, so I have no idea about the health issues related to them.

The only place I have heard of people with crossbreeds is on Dogsey, as previous doggy forums I have been with have been Chi forums, so obviously, pedigree dogs.

What I can say though, is that in my life I have owned (including my parents dogs) 5 pedigree (some reg some not) dogs that have lived up until their teens. The only one that had any health issues at all was the 9 year old Yorkie boy I rescued. He had a heart murmer and lung issues but he still lived until he was 13 (ish) the age from the Rescue was a bit sketchy (more of an estimate, as the owner had died).

Of course, now I have eight pedigree Chihuahuas but the oldest is not three yet and Phoebe and Frankie are only four months old, so it's early days with regard to health issues. On the whole though, they seem a very healthy bunch. Rarely go to the Vets (usually only for vaccs - except when one of the two girls I have bred have been to the Vets for health checks and so on to do with whelping - so not really relevant to this discussion).

So I suppose, I am saying that the Pedigree dogs I have had have all been healthy

For what it's worth, my Mum always tells me how much healthier dogs were years ago, when there were lots of crosses and no such thing as dried food (most dogs being fed scraps and butchers cuts) but I think that is more an opinion rather than fact

How many people on here have a good old-fashioned mongrel (dog of mixed ancestry back at least 3 generations)? I haven`t seen one for ages!

I agree

Great post!!!


If you had a very well bred pedigree dog..that was chucked out at a young age to life as a stray, to fend for its self, no flea, mite treatment etc and scavange food as alot of those dogs you are talking about have to in those countries I dont think that animal would look wonderful either!!!
So I dont think that really comes into it, I mean I dont see to many wonderful tramps do you?

No, but you do see dogs of suspect parentage walking round with growths the size of tennis balls... dogs with obviously bad hips, eye conditions and any other outwardly visable problems.. that some would only associate with pedigrees..