RMB's include large knuckle type bones, bones that are not devoured as a meal, as such, but more recreational. What I meant was, they should be only given once or twice a week as a meal, or as a recreational, but certainly not every day as a meal.

Main meals should be racks, necks, carcasses, wings, etc, softer, easily devoured bones, with more meat on them and cartilage etc.

Hope that makes sense Mys

I think enevitably we are probably feeding quite similar what you class as 'main meal' type bones I class as rmb, a softer completly edible bone with more meat on them...Although I have to say I look for meatier bones to feed so that I don't have to add as much meat separately (instead of necks and carcasses I will feed whole chicken (halved or quartered or whatever) and instead of ribs I feed a very meaty breast of lamb etc...I still add separate meat throughout the diet but not as much as I would need to if I was feeding less meaty bones...Still no matter how it is achieved, so long as it isn't to much bone it doesn't matter.

Recreational bones I class as a bone that has a sparse amount of meat on it and is something like a knuckle or marrow bone.

To add: say if I was feeding a whole rabbit or something, to me this is a complete 'prey' item (if fed with inerds intact or else they are added) an rmb that needs no meat adding. It's raw and it's meat and it's bones Something like a carcuss (with meat stripped) or a turkey neck is a rmb too but of course needs alot of meat adding elsewhere in the diet. RMB's can vastly differ so what else you feed with them will be influenced by the type of rmb you are feeding at the time.

Spot On ......lol

Pretty much the same really, but yeah everyone terms things differently, but the same.

I love giving my lot fresh rabbit, although my boy wont eat the heads, I swear he thinks they are looking at him.......lol

you try cooking green tripe, and then repeat that statement

this thread has been really interesting, but for me, i'm still not convinced. the bones would put me off.

if it came to it and i had to change H's diet again i think the fresh cooked diet would be on the cards.

for loki

there is no evidence that kibble causes bloat. i've extensively researched this after H had it in august.

for sbt

dogs are omnivours not carnivors.

Sorry, I totally disagree.
All my dogs have been fed kibble.
They all have fantastic teeth and their poos are solid and compact.
They certainly do not, at any point 'nibble kibble'...munch/crunch/enjoy...yes, no sign of any nibbling in this house at any point.

I'm pleased BARF works for your dogs, as I've said...kibble is fantastic for mine. My older guys have such good teeth (with no extra teeth cleaning aids...the vets are visibly impressed.

Whole eggs are fine to give to dogs, egg whites should not be fed on their own.

.
http://www.provet.co.uk/health/diseases/eggwhite.htm

I have read much about feeding eggs to dogs and have discussed the matter with a number of vets who say eggs are fine as long as you don't feed egg whites on their own, as with most things feed in moderation as part of a varied diet.
Dogs in the wild would eat whole eggs, they would not pause to separate the whites they would eat the eggs shell and all. Likewise if they are eating the carcass of a hen bird that could contain eggs.

Egg whites are a good source of protein and trace elements,whole eggs are nutritious and easy to digest and I have kept many sick dogs and puppies alive on a diet containing eggs.

I don't know about proof but the general opinion on domestication now, is that wolves first became associated with humans thousands of years ago, around camp sites where they scavenged on waste which would have included a large proportion of cooked cereal.

The wolves most capable of thriving on this diet would be the ones that formed the ancestors of our domestic dogs and so the genes for this carried forward to the next generations.

Primitive type dogs still surviving on this regime still exist today eg the Canaan Dog in its native Israel, descended from the Middle Eastern pariah dogs.

The various paths of domestication have meant that some breeds have developed on cereal rich diets, the Collies in particular where meat was at a premium. Cooked cereal, oats for the Scottish breeds formed a large part of the diet. Dogs that couldn't cope with this simply wouldn't survive so the breeds naturally developed a digestion to suit their environment.

I do think that raw bone can be dangerous for some dogs but have no doubt that a diet containing a proportion of raw meat and bones is beneficial for most, but what the BARF regime doesn't seem to embrace is the vast diversity that has developed within the species. As others here have already said, the diet that suits you and your dog is the best one for him.

Thanks Hectorsmum. I guess nobody knows for certain but there is some uncertainty out there, just as there is with bones. I was told this by a dog trainer but there is also reference to it on the Internet. I suppose it is unclear really; just as with most things related to dog and diet. It's just as bad as the varying opinions on human diet .
Here are just a couple of bits I found but as you say, hard evidence seems lacking - unless anyone else has any?

"Causes
In dogs, the causes of bloat are unclear, and currently there is little agreement on the factors that may contribute. Some of the more widely acknowledged factors are stress, eating foods such as kibble that expand in the stomach, swallowing too much air while eating, overfeeding, and other causes of gastrointestinal distress."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloat

"Dogs seem prone to "bloat" between the ages of four and seven years of age, and two-thirds (2/3) of the dogs were male. "Bloat" occurred in dogs who tended to eat large quantities of dry kibble, followed by drinking large amounts of water. Especially dangerous was when a period of vigorous exercise follows the meal and water combination. A dog with an individual history of digestive upsets may suddenly experience the acute stages of G.D.V. "

http://www.barkbytes.com/medical/med0007.htm

[QUOTE=Minihaha;792194]Whole eggs are fine to give to dogs, egg whites should not be fed on their own.

/QUOTE]

Phew thanks Mini. I have been giving Loki 1 - 2 whole raw eggs a week and I had thought it was okay.

Hi Hectors Mum yes I would agree dogs are omnivores and opportunist eaters, they will eat just about anything if left to their own devices. If you threw your dog out it would raid dustbins and eat anything remotely edible not just meat so to my mind the dog we have today (and that is after all what we are talking about, the evolved dog) is not a true carnivore.

Regarding kibble, yes I think it could cause bloat although I doubt you will find much research for this, research needs funding and as a lot of research is funded by multinationals who have an interest in complete dog food there is unlikely to be much research on this subject .

If you look at it logically, the dehydrated pellets of food that many complete foods are made up of swell when they come into contact with water. Dogs fed complete food drink large amounts of water at a time (I have observed this and note when you stop feeding complete food a dogs water intake drops considerably) I would think therefore that when complete food comes into contact with water and digestive fluids in a dogs stomach and swells this could make a dogs stomach swell too and cause bloat, that is why many recommend two small meals of complete per day ,so there is less food in the dogs stomach at one time.