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Borderdawn
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22-04-2008, 02:49 PM
The brown puppy is how they should be, they shouldnt be held at all Karen, if the tail set is correct then the tail will fall correct. The fact that Dobe people have altered the construction of this breed is exactly why there is a problem with the tails!! Of course we should be concentrating on tail sets, for flips sake the conformation of the dog is paramount! Forget holding these tails, breed dogs with correct tail sets!
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dollyknockers
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22-04-2008, 02:57 PM
Originally Posted by Bilclarie View Post
The tail docked or not needs to be a continuation of the spine and thats what needs to be seen, I have seen them held up and over the back and left like below, this female below was a crufts qualifier.




Mo and the Gang
I think this way looks so much nicer , Relaxed and natural , lovely we dog btw xxdk
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Jackie
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22-04-2008, 03:00 PM
Originally Posted by Patch View Post
I don`t know if I should be relieved at myself for putting it ok or worried for you that you actually understood what I meant

same here, maybe today we are on the same wavelength
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Patch
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22-04-2008, 03:28 PM
Originally Posted by Jackbox View Post
same here, maybe today we are on the same wavelength
I`m in the middle of a cluster headache, what`s your excuse
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Patch
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22-04-2008, 03:39 PM
Originally Posted by Borderdawn View Post
The brown puppy is how they should be, they shouldnt be held at all Karen, if the tail set is correct then the tail will fall correct. The fact that Dobe people have altered the construction of this breed is exactly why there is a problem with the tails!! Of course we should be concentrating on tail sets, for flips sake the conformation of the dog is paramount! Forget holding these tails, breed dogs with correct tail sets!
Are you sitting down - I agree with you
I`ve never really understood why any tails are held, docked or not, but that`s a personal thing I think, I just like to see dogs standing more naturally full stop so if there are faults they would show up more but good natural conformation would really shine. [ But I like to see Collies wagging lots which is`nt ideal in the show ring so there you go ]
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Jackie
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22-04-2008, 03:43 PM
Originally Posted by Patch View Post
I`m in the middle of a cluster headache, what`s your excuse
I`m on the change
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mcgregorkh
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22-04-2008, 05:42 PM
Originally Posted by Borderdawn View Post
The brown puppy is how they should be, they shouldnt be held at all Karen, if the tail set is correct then the tail will fall correct. The fact that Dobe people have altered the construction of this breed is exactly why there is a problem with the tails!! Of course we should be concentrating on tail sets, for flips sake the conformation of the dog is paramount! Forget holding these tails, breed dogs with correct tail sets!
The thing is Dawn you seem to misunderstood what I meant. Yes we should be breeding for the correct tailset and conformation etc as I have already said before but this thread is not about that.

I am going on what is happening in the dobe ring now, the general concensus not what I personally think or otherwise. Whether you agree with the majority of the dobe people or not at the moment there is much debate about the subject of what is to be done. I know this for a fact because I have a pup with a tail and every show I have taken her to people are discussing it! And in all honesty with all due respect Dawn I take the advice of the people who I know and trust and are involved with dobes at the present time and have been for years including those with tails. My pup has a correct tail set but her tail goes in different directions depending on her mood. And to be honest the majority of the time when she holds her tail in that position (of the brown pup) is when she's about to poo.
That brown puppy whose pic is on this thread isn't on the breeders website anymore???(or should I say I couldn't find it!) And if a docked dog is top and tailed whilst being shown (as the majority of them are) then pushing the tail up slightly is exactly the same

I don't know whether it is intentional but your posts come across as slightly aggressive towards my opinion whenever I mention dobermanns, even if your post isn't relative to the thread
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Bilclarie
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22-04-2008, 06:15 PM
Just to say the brown bitch I placed on here is still on the breeders web site or was 5 mins ago show people and judges will struggle to know what a tail should be like as there not that use to seeing them, I can remember years ago at a show there was a tailed Dobe and the judge didn't know what to make of it then, I'm sure they will come up with an answer at somepoint but for now all you have to worry about is that the tail is a continuation of the spine whether the dog is holding it naturally or the handler is holding it up, all the Dobes I have seen in the ring carry them quite high and I've seen quite a few, ask the breeder if your unsure they should know if they are show people.

Mo and the Gang
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Shona
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22-04-2008, 06:33 PM
I had mark at training last week with his new boxer pup, apparently the are holding the tail bent in towards the handler like the first photo jackbox put up
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Borderdawn
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22-04-2008, 07:03 PM
Yes Karen you arent looking, the brown pup is still on the website.

Im not aggresive at all Karen, I just dont like how people alter a breeds construction, then when the docking ban comes in have to have such ridiculous debates about what to do with them, its ridiculous!

Any breed with a tail should let it hang naturally, I mean how many Rottweiler people are faffing with them? Yes Dobes are top and tailed, but usually moulded into place to hid faults or accentuate the better points. I appreciate I have only been involved with them for 20yrs and you have been showing for a few, and perhaps that makes me not know what Im talking about, but you, the younger showers should be concentrating on showing dogs with the correct conformation and not be worried about what happens to the appendage that hangs off the back of them, because if the dogs that are being bred were correct, the breed standard would apply, wouldnt it! Look at the brown puppy!!!
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