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Tupacs2legs
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27-11-2010, 01:22 PM
Originally Posted by x-clo-x View Post
yeah after the pain theyve been through of ripping their tail to shreds.
so 'just in case' is a good reason for amputation in your eyes?

lol really lol ..... no point even discussing with peeps like you.... ears get ripped more than tails... lets chop them off too yay!!!!!!

btw...not comming back to this thread...so dont really care what the 'docking brigade' have to say on the subject.
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Kicks
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27-11-2010, 01:23 PM
If the dog has been legally docked for work then I think they should be able to enter any shows including Crufts. The Kennel Club claim to be all about Fit for Function and educating people? So let the legally docked dogs in and explain to the general public WHY some dogs are allowed to be docked and others aren't. Then when they go looking at puppy's they will know the right questions to ask about docked pups.

Just my opinion.

H x
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x-clo-x
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27-11-2010, 01:25 PM
Originally Posted by Tupacs2legs View Post
so 'just in case' is a good reason for amputation in your eyes?

lol really lol ..... no point even discussing with peeps like you.... ears get ripped more than tails... lets chop them off too yay!!!!!!

btw...not comming back to this thread...so dont really care what the 'docking brigade' have to say on the subject.
ive already said i dont agree with all dogs being docked, but oens that work yes i will stand by that. "just in case" happens more than you think it does. but until you have been out and seeing a working dog split its tail then i suppose you will agree "just in case" happens once in a blue moon.
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Tupacs2legs
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27-11-2010, 01:30 PM
Originally Posted by x-clo-x View Post
ive already said i dont agree with all dogs being docked, but oens that work yes i will stand by that. "just in case" happens more than you think it does. but until you have been out and seeing a working dog split its tail then i suppose you will agree "just in case" happens once in a blue moon.
whos says i havnt seen a split tail you presume i havnt... now i am gone cheerio
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Jackie
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27-11-2010, 01:35 PM
Originally Posted by Tarimoor View Post
Posting and dashing (as usual) but, I think the whole point is, for those breeds where docking is done to prevent injury when working, then they are unable to compete in the show ring at an equal level to those who don't work their dogs, but just show them and therefore don't dock. It's a great way to breed dogs where their ability is unknown; being a fan of working gundogs dogs, I like to see them doing what they were bred to do, and you can see they absolutely love it, it's in their blood. So why penalise those who are actually out there, proving the ability of their dogs, by preventing them from showing them as well at any level?

Tupac, I'd like to see you hold the same views when you're several miles up on a grouse moor, or in the back of a woodland, with a spaniel or other breed that's split it's tail wide open and is losing blood every time it wags the darn thing, because they still don't stop wagging. The end third is taken off with spaniels, I think it's the end two thirds on HPR's from memory, both are the parts that are more 'prone' to injury, and these dogs are left with a tail to wag.

Something I've queried in the past, and been shot down in flames as 'just having a go', is where the show dock for gundog breeds has come from in relation to this? It has honestly shocked me to see breeds docked to a stump, and bears no relation to the working dock. To me, the only reason for docking to that extreme is aesthetic, and not something I'd agree with at all.

Why?? a dock is a dock, regardless of how long the tail ends up.


If you are pro docking whats the difference , the dog /pup will have it docked at the same age, the "pain" felt by the pup will be the same (or not) depending on your point of view, whether it has a 1/3 or more of its tail taken off.


Originally Posted by Kicks View Post
If the dog has been legally docked for work then I think they should be able to enter any shows including Crufts. The Kennel Club claim to be all about Fit for Function and educating people? So let the legally docked dogs in and explain to the general public WHY some dogs are allowed to be docked and others aren't. Then when they go looking at puppy's they will know the right questions to ask about docked pups.

Just my opinion.

H x
Good post, and bang on topic, the topic is not about whether or not you agree with docking, but the lunacy of not allowing docked dogs (after 07) to be shown at some shows!

No body here has yet to come up with a good reason to support the restriction.

Except the same old, " I dont agree , its barbaric"!
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x-clo-x
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27-11-2010, 01:35 PM
Originally Posted by Tupacs2legs View Post
whos says i havnt seen a split tail you presume i havnt... now i am gone cheerio
i didnt say you havent seen one... i meant it occurs more in working dogs than what people think it does.
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Tarimoor
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27-11-2010, 02:15 PM
Originally Posted by Jackbox View Post
Why?? a dock is a dock, regardless of how long the tail ends up.


If you are pro docking whats the difference , the dog /pup will have it docked at the same age, the "pain" felt by the pup will be the same (or not) depending on your point of view, whether it has a 1/3 or more of its tail taken off.
Because the reason the end third is taken off with spaniels, is that it is the part most prone to injury, so why dock the whole tail off, leaving nothing to wag? The tail is a very important part of the spaniel's movement, and dogs that have been over docked are frowned on in competition. I'm assuming the same goes for HPR's, but will rely on someone involved with them more to confirm if this is the case or not.
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JoedeeUK
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27-11-2010, 02:47 PM
It's not the KC it's DEFRA, the law is that legally docked dogs born after the docking ban came into force cannot be compete at events where the public has to pay for admission.Lots of the other shows charge for the car park & not for admission to get round the DEFRA ban & it is within the KC rules for legally docked dogs to be shown.

Crufts could not manage without the public admission money

Under Scottish Law(not the Scottish KC)no dog docked after the date the law changed can compete even if there is no admission fee
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Rolosmum
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27-11-2010, 02:54 PM
Does seem daft to me, but then i own a docked spaniel and have seen a dog nearly die through an injured tail, so personally i dont feel that i would be against paying to watch a dog in a dog show just cos its tail is docked, again as long as this is legal.

I am not planning on showing or working my dog, just training for our own personal pet and to keep his mind occupied.
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rune
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27-11-2010, 04:04 PM
It is only going to happen if dogs work and show----very rarely does that happen.

I think it is illegal to sell the dog docked unless it is going to be worked?

rune
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