You should try it on walks even when there arent many dogs around...like if he is ahead sniffing whatever then just disappear behind a bush/tree etc...it will make him more aware of where you are in case you are likely to disappear again!

Sorry I have only read 1/2 the posts on here but thought I would add my 2p worth

I know how distressing it is - but you have done great so far in the house and in the garden
Can you get to secure empty fields outside?
Its a big step to go from boring garden to exciting outside

also do you do any other training when you are outside? can he sit? walk nicely to heel?

Does he take treats/play with toys at all at any point when you are outside?

Its good to play games where he naturally wants to come to you

First thing I did was just gave a few treats whenever Mia accidently passed anywere close to me - then sending her off again to play before she got a chance to run away herself

then after about a week of doing this she started checking in on me more often and I could call her when she was already heading towards me

Also I would drop a small amount of treats on the ground then run away from her so when she looked up from eating them I was racing away - and she gave chase, when she caught up I dropped more treats and again ran away

both these ones I am not asking her to do anything she is choosing to be with me - if she wants to run off and play then fair nuff

If at any point she has gone out of sight (its a safe area with no other dogs) I DONT call for her - calling when she is out of sight means she knows where I am. I keep dead silent - and reward like mad when she chooses to come and find me


also practise loads of fun things when she is with you so she learns to love being close to you and checks in with you often

I found a great panic recal - but you sound mad doing it with other people around - HOOOOOWWWWLLLLLLL every dog in the area comes a running if you do a good howl


Im sorry SB I dont agree with starving a dog to get them to obey, yup they shouldnt be full up but I do remember reading studies on rats that if they were really hungry they were unable to learn


Like anything if the dog is unable to take treats in a certain location head to a less stimulating area and work slowly towards more stimulating environments

Oh dear, since when did HUNGER = STARVATION?

Tsk tsk tsk,

Most owners I know prefer a hungry dog to a dead one.

They also prefer a hungry one to one that can never be let off the lead safely.

I, as a fellow dog owner and one who gets fed up with seeing out of control dogs ALSO prefer hungry dogs to untrained ones.

So do my dogs.

Deprivation is required in ALL training, whether that be food, attention, toy etc after all that is what negative punishmen is all about!

You take away what the dog wants.

If you cannot take away the dogs, you have to take the dog away from the dogs, if that makes sense.

But owners have to make up their own minds and decide which is the greater of two evils

You were advising skipping several meals
Very low blood sugar is not conducive to good learning

Skipping meals is not the only way to train a dog, I was in no way saying let the dog be out of control
I was putting forward another point of view
You say - dog not interested in treats - withold meals until the dog is interested in treats
I suggested moving him to less stimulating area so he is able to take treats

Tabitha - also wanted to add

Keep playing recal all the time in places it works
In the house and in the garden

and when you are on walks play a little on the lead on the way to the park
and play and treat and stuff in the park when you feel the other distractions are far enough away that he can focus a little bit

I read somewhere you need to do something 1000 time before it is perfect - so if you figure in 10 fun successfull recals a day then less than 1/2 a year you will be there (and of course it will get better all the time)

Thanks so much for the encouragement and help, really appreciated

Dexter will not play with toys in the home most of the time, and outside the home he literally will just ignore them. I've tried taking the only toy he actually likes to the park - he didn't want to know.

However, I could try your suggestion about dropping the treats and then dashing off

I will definitely try the things you have kindly suggested, sounds like fun and hopefully will work with Dex.

If for any reason it does not do the trick I will follow what SB advises - I don't like the idea of witholding food but I have to somehow achieve a proper recall.

Many thanks again and I am looking forward to trying your suggestions


RE THE HOWL

Love it

The other dog owners at our local park all think I'm mad anyway because I don't let Dex off the lead!!! (they think recall is an optional extra).

I think a good hooowwwwwwllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll in the park might be quite cathartic actually

I do not disagree that there are other methods, but none of em seem to be working; but neither did I accuse you of trying to bore the dog to death by moving it to a less stimulating area.

Ie I do not believe that less stimulating = total sensory deprivation

Any more than I believe that hunger = starvation.

Neither method is mutually exclusive.

And if the dog is still running after dogs, its blood sugar aint that low!

It is a simple biological fact!

TJ has posted several times that whenever she takes the dog out it appears to be very stimulating, sometimes if you have no choice or if you DO choose to go to the park, you have to decide whether or not to train (as she posted) or to train in spite of those distractions.

She already stated that he had skipped his tea the night before and his breaky that morning - so 2 missed meals and he was still unable to take treats
How many more meals do you suggest he skips? and do you not agree that that many missed meals will have effected his blood sugar levels - there is a big difference between concentraiting and learning, and running off to play

If you look at my posts I am not saying skip training, train train train, train at home, train in the garden, train on the way to the park, train in the park when the dogs are at such a distance that he is able to focus


and tabitha I know what you mean netiher of mine were very toy-ee I have finnally got them playing but its not something I could use for training much
but treats is great because you can quickly see if things have become too exciting for him if he wont take the treat - just take a few steps back

If it really comes to it take a good book and sit in a quiet corner of the park and wait till he stops being interested in all the other dogs and starts paying attention to you eventually all the dogs will become boring - then you can make yourself exciting

I think training something like this isnt all about 1 method - its about as many methods as work and make being with you fun

Which is why I'll just "Big up" Recall workshops again. Lots of practise with the controlled distraction of having other dogs around.

Does/ did Dexter go to training classes? Found being with other dogs in situations where they weren't running/ there wasn't the opportunity to run - around like lunatics useful too.

Occasionally do the hiding thing myself for practise when the terrierist is involved in a scent BUT his number one priority is not losing me & he's good at checking back.

Yep I also posted about recall workshops, plenty of them around by some very good people.

The thing about dogs is you can classically condition dogs very easily to associate the presence of dogs as the signal for fun to begin with you, rather than being the SOURCE of fun.

So if dogs are more fun to be around than the owner, you cannot blame the dog for bogging off.

But sometimes you have to get the dog into a POSITION to learn and the dog may self reward simply by being out and observing.......

It is really knowing dogs isn't it, and especially the predispostion of breeds.

Labradors are very foody hence the suggestion of food as a first try especially if the dog cannot or will not play with toys.