Is Heidi having a laugh at me?

Heidi has been taught to stop on a single whistle pip reinforced with a hand signal, and recall on three pips.

She stops 9 times out of 10 on a stop and probably the same on recall.

She will also retrieve to hand 100% with a dummy, but not with a ball which is fine, balls are for playing with.

If I give a stop followed by a retrieve, fine.

The problem is if I give a stop followed by a recall, she just sits there looking at me as if she's waiting for me to ask her to do something. The only way to get her to move is either to throw a dummy or send her away, which I think is what she'd like me to do, or walk up to her and release her.

I've tried coaxing her to me, down on hands on knee's, calling her excitedly and turning and walking away, but still she sits there. I've also cut the retrieves to just one for her per training session in-case she was getting her highs from retrieves.

I'm sure its a mistake I've trained, because we did have a problem with our stops, so I trained a stop as a stay with the word "STAY" dropping the command stay when she got it.

I hope that all makes sense, any idea's how I can seperate the stay and stop again.

I have no expertise at all in training sporting/gundogs so don't know if I can help at all.

In obedience 'wait' means remain where you are until I tell you to do something; 'stay' means do not move until I return to you & release you. So 'stop'='wait' yes?

If it was obedience I would advise going right back to basics. Put her in a wait/stop on a long line, give the recall signal and, if she ignored it, gently encourage her in with the line & huge fuss & reward when she gets to you. I would also use the recall signal around the house, particularly prior to putting her food down, & prior to games/stroking/petting etc. She then assocites the recall with being close to you & good things happening.

If she has been doing well up to this point it might just be a little blip which back to basics training can sort out.

Is there an experienced gundog trainer that you can ask about this as I am not sure that ordinary ob. training is applicable to your discipline? If you search Google for "gundog forum" you will get several sites which might be able to assist.

Thanks Shadow,

I hadn't thought about using a longline, I'll give that a try.

As for the gundog part of it, we did go to a gundog club, as an interest for us both rather then for hunting purposes and Heidi progressed well, till we got to a point where it was suggested firmer methods were needed to sharpen her reactions, so we left

We also had a go at obediance classes held at the local kennels, but I don't think springers are cut out for that really.

Robert, if I can obedience train Boxers I am quite sure you can train Heidi. Sounds as though she is already pretty good, just a question of finding the right trainer & the right training method.

Another thought. She is associating the stop with stay, presumably because you have previously gone back to her on the stop & rewarded. So she is sitting there expecting a reward for her lovely 'stay'. After you have trained on the long line for a while and are ready to try a free recall, give your recall signal and then do nothing (have a seat handy as it could take a while). As soon as she gets bored and starts to move give the signal again and run backwards calling her in all the time. Reward & fuss

I agree the 'firmer methods' do not sound like fun - & that is what training should be for dog & handler, lots & lots of fun!

Sb

We had a good day on the long lead, and Heidi is now doing recalls after a stop, thanks Shadow

Excellent Robert. Good work, and thank you for letting me know