Dogsey

I really do have to take issue with what you have said here. Are you a vet? If not, I wonder just what qualifies you to contemptuously and airily brush aside their opinions and experience, not to mention seven years of training.

We used to give our last dog bones, big chunky ones from the butcher...........and of course she adored them. However, we had to stop feeding them after a near fatal episode when she managed to swallow a large sharp piece. (This same dog also nearly died when eating a pigs ear by the way, and it may just be that some dogs are too lazy to chew for as long as they should).

Your statement that bones are essential for all dogs is a sweeping statement too far! Our present dog can have no animal protein whatsoever, and there are many others like him. He eats nothing but fish and vegetables........in kibble form.

I agree with you Bitkin. These statements made by Gnasher strike a chord with me, as well...

"raw food is best for any dog"

That is a blatantly false statement. Many dogs can't tolerate raw food and have persistent diarrhea while on it but do fine on kibble.

It's like me saying just because my dog lives a long time on garbage food, that I can go telling other people that higher quality food isn't ever needed. That's complete crap.

Feeding your dog raw food doesn't always lead to a healthier dog and there is scarcely a study that proves raw fed dogs always live longer.

"raw bones are an excellent food for our dogs, which is why most dogs object if you try and remove a bone from them!"

Not if dogs choke on them. Not if they puncture their mouths/intestines with sharp bones pieces. Not if the dog does fine without said bones. Not all dogs need raw bones, and raw bones given randomly can cause problems.

"Nature speaks for itself..."

Some dogs won't touch raw food. I have owned two and have heard of quite a few others. Hardly nature speaking if the dog won't even touch any raw food.

Also, dogs eat chocolate, grapes, and many other things that will kill them - I guess that is nature speaking, as well?

Also, resource guarding isn't nature speaking, its the owner failing to speak. Gnasher, surely your dog and the progress you've made with him causes you to realize this.

"Dogs cannot get salmonella poisoning from eating raw chicken meat, wings or whole carcase."

Another blatantly untrue statement. Salmonella poisoning HAS been seen in dogs although it is rare. The reported cases of salmonella have been mostly linked to the consumption of raw meat. Your dog is at higher risk if he is immuno-compromised.

In the end, you need to feed your dog what he does well on. Not all dogs do well on raw food, so not all dogs need to be fed raw food.

My puppy loved raw food but didn't chew well or something and his teeth were going sour with a quickness. He's on kibble now and his teeth are back in pristine condition.

A bit of opinion here for the finish...

I think the BARF diet is a good deal of garbage. I think raw food is really good for most dogs, and I highly recommend it even though I don't feed it... but NEVER would I recommend the BARF diet. I always tell people to shoot for the prey model diet if they are looking at raw feeding.

I have heard of dogs on vegan/vegetarian diets these days, as well. Dogs are carnivores, they are meant to eat meat. Dogs are not omnivores (one look at their teeth can confirm this, not a flat tooth in their mouths) and I'm not sure why people are trying to say that, they are simply not obligate carnivores like cats.

This simply means they CAN absorb vegetable protein, it doesn't mean that a diet loaded with veggies is good for them. If your dog does well on it - SURE but as a recommended diet? Absolutely not.

Clearly you know little about the barf diet if you think that it's loaded with veg. It most certainly should not be. My boy gets about a tablespoon of raw puréed veg daily plus a whole raw carrot mixed in with approx a pound and half of raw meat and a dose of salmon oil. And a raw meaty bone once or twice. Dogs are primarily carnivores with a very small requirement for plant matter.

I have seen people use a lot more veggies than that. People use the BARF diet however they want to. This is done to suit their purposes and their individual dogs, of course. There is not only one way to do it. Also, I didn't expressly say that the BARF diet was loaded with veggies.

Actually, everyone I've seen who uses the BARF diet (as opposed to the prey model) uses a lot more veggies than that. I looked on YouTube, as well as looked around the web and generally... more veggies are used than that.

Again, I think raw feeding is best for most dogs, when done correctly... I simply prefer prey model over BARF because it has less veggies (ideally none) and more animal protein such as eggs.

I think you did - see post number 60 your last paragraph

Although I prefer to feed a small amount of veg I think the prey model diet is the next best thing and vastly superior to commercial dog food - I think he tablespoon of puréed veg that Ben has everyday is just the icing on the cake - his daily multivitamin pill! Ben has a whole raw egg including the shell, and wherever possible he is fed fur and feather, guts. And stomach contents.

Yes, yes I see that line. There was a solid reason it wasn't inserted into a previous paragraph when BARF was actually mentioned. It wasn't expressly meant for BARF feeders.

I was speaking about the vegetarian/vegan diets that people use sometimes. I know that BARF has lots of meat, but I have seen people abuse (IMO) the right to feed vegetables in the diet and end up giving the dog too many.

This is why I always steer people towards the prey model diet instead of the BARF diet. Like I said, whatever your dog does well on - feed him that... but to me, prey model is better than BARF.

That is where our opinions differ, which of course is not a big deal seeing as we agree on the base of the subject.. which is that raw feeding is better than commercial diets in general.

Gnasher, you have your opinion and others are entitled to theirs - I find some of your comments on this subject laughable; it seems that you are the world's authority on the subject of feeding dogs, and nothing other than your way is the way to go for ALL dogs. Tosh.

As for saying that the fish I, and many many others in a similar position feed their dogs with allergies, is animal protein, yes it is....... however it is a protein that they are able to cope with and it works for them.

I am glad that the diet you use works for your dogs but please don't assume that it is right for everyone because it isn't

The best diet out there is the one that suits your individual dog the best.
Just like us dogs are individuals and not any one diet suits all.

I know an elderly lady that has always free fed her dog Bakers complete. While I hate this food with a passion her dog is now 18 years old and very fit and healthy enjoying his twice daily walks and still plays with toys. So for him its been a good food and obviously done him no harm..