Welcome!! How have you enjoyed your first 12 days on Dogsey? Have you resolved all your issues with your dog since you joined? Do you know AP from another forum? Just curious.

ahhh so you inflict pain on your dog to ease your own guilt.

...try a teenage csv or sibe... youd be in tears lol ... actually no dont

hmm.....more like 12 mins

Well I`m not that fussed about be ing in Michael M`s good books so...
ain`t it funny that the newbie`s grammar is exactly like Adams?

No, but maybe disgusted that you choose a dog which could have the traits of both parent which are energetic, intelligent dogs and once they hit their teenage phase (which all dogs have so no big surprise there) you decide the best form of training is to inflict pain to stop their natural behaviour, a quick fix, no effort, well done!!!!

.....or a Ridgeback, Beau is nearly 3 and is still in his unruly teenage stage

Now you are right, but funny, how people jump on join a forum, hop on a controversial thread, and this after all that is written we finally have someone do all the above and not want to back the story up or tell anymore, why couldn't your A,B,C or D be possible?? maybe it is you in disguise

I was out doing some training the other week when Locky decided to go self employed for a while-he was off lead, and about 20m away. I was getting frustrated, and remember thinking to myself: "if I could squirt you or spray you now -you'd get it (I don't actually own/carry any kind of squirt/spray device), or if I had an e-collar, I'd zap you on full."

What actually happened was, that I went over to him, said his name - he looked at me and melted my heart (as he always does). I said "come on mate", we went for a potter along the lochside with him having a roam around and a good sniff, we went home happy, and did some more training the next day.

I was in Pets at Home a few days later and noticed the spray collars on sale. I was quite saddened to see these so freely available and recalled my frustration a few days earlier, it struck me how easily any remote collar (spray/vibrating/electric) might be used in anger and as a stress reaction (wording courtesy KW). I stood there thinking to myself "it's not a remote collar that people need - it's a willingness to put in some effort and spend some time with their dogs.

Maybe my views on remote collars of any kind aren't that far from the party line after all.

Strange then that I'm not pro ban for e-collars and think they me be a valid training tool in some circumstances.

I'm not advocating that e-collars are used as a first port of call method, but for some dogs, with some serious, persistant, long standing problem, provided that all other avenues have been exhausted. And then provided that the e-collar is used under supervision by a qualified trainer/behaviourist.

I can see the flaw in that point of view - it's likely that in most cases, a qualified/experienced trainer/behaviourist might have no need to resort to using an e-collar.

Despite the ban, it's not illegal to own an e-collar in Wales (or wasn't last time I actually looked up the act of the assembly). It's not illegal to buy an e-collar by mail order. I think there was an estimated 20000 (IIRC) e-collars in Wales, I suspect, that some of those will be being used at moments of frustration as I experienced, and will be being used in anger as a stress reactor.

I would like to see remote collars removed from the shelves of the shops, and only be avaiable having undergone supervised training - totally impractical I realise, but that's how I feel. I'd like to see more people put in more time and effort with their dogs, then maybe we'd have fewer problems all round.

I saw a 'Its me or the dog USA' This woman had a bulldog and went to trainers when the dog was a Puppy and they recommended e collars. The poor dog as a Puppy got shocked so much (by the so called trainer) as a Puppy Marks were left on it's neck, The woman then went to another trainer who advised a Citronella collar. So Victoria stillwell went on a walk with the woman and when the dog wouldn't do what she wanted she sprayed him 15 times! Surprise it still didn't stop the behaviour.


But a little time put in in Positive training methods and there was a huge difference.

We all get frustrated when dog training but the thing is most people realise that causing pain isn't the answer.

When we drive a car, we put a lot of effort into learning how to drive and pass the Test - otherwise, we cannot drive on the road and would be illegal to do so as we would put ourselves in danger.

It's similar with a pet dog. I realise people get frustrated, but time and time again it is all about them finding out HOW to train a dog, UNDERSTANDING about teenage years and HOW to work through that to get the dog they hope for,and that will live another 12 or so years with them.

At times, one does have to think laterally. My friend had a bearded collie that, in spite of reasonably consistent training from her (not the same as he'd have from me, but pretty good) insisted on bogging off on every walk.

He was castrated and it solved the problem almost overnight. I went out with her and saw how he was, and it wasn't about being disobedient, it was purely hormonal, full stop

Similarly with young bitches, they can get very "odd" and may not listen if they are around 3 weeks or so close to their first season.

I think we just do need more education for pet owners, but the problem is that some will sadly not put in the effort. (Like the ones that resort to ecollars).

If this was done with driving, they'd just not pass the test. But with a live dog, there is no good test, so they may resort to other methods due to frustration, embarassment, worry, etc

But at the end of the day, they may even be "overdogged" - ultimately, it's really not the dog's fault and the dog should not be shocked because they owner cannot or does not want to take advantage of education.

Wys
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