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Malka
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31-10-2014, 07:48 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfwitch View Post
Without necessarily being for or against the idea of rescuing foreign dogs, I do wonder if we are not unwittingly contributing to the problem. I'm sure by now people in those countries are starting to figure out there are tons of bleeding hearts over here whole will dig deep to import a dog?
Is that not going to result in a booming puppy farm business over there?

I understand a lot of the problems in those countries stem from unspayed strays and a totally different attitude towards animals and their worth.

I'm not convinced either way I have to say.
Not just digging deep to import a dog, but spending thousands on just one dog which could have gone a long way to helping local dogs in rescue.

This is one example:

http://www.itv.com/news/anglia/2014-...osthetic-legs/

The dog, sweet as she is, was not only brought Britain from Romania but the supporters of the charity concerned raised £3,000 in order to pay for prosthetic legs.

How many local unwanted dogs in need of rescue/rehoming would that money have helped?
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halfpenny
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31-10-2014, 10:23 PM
Other health concerns with importing or taking dogs abroad.

http://www.researchgate.net/profile/...f2534c7660a009
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lovemybull
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01-11-2014, 03:51 AM
It's the same idea as why I'm against people leaving dogs intact here in the states. Especially among the bully breeds. Some of the city shelters put down countless dogs WEEKLY. I feel it's totally irresponsible to breed more, to import some fashionable breed when there are so very many dogs being put to death. Tell those people to use that money to help a bunch of pups who need it. Spending an astronomical amount for a "special breed". At the end of the day it's still simply a dog. Grrr makes my hackles go up thinking about it.
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JoedeeUK
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01-11-2014, 08:51 AM
So me keeping my dogs entire is causing the number of dogs in rescue to rise, I think not. My bitches I have spayed because the pros well out number the cons for bitches & my males have never sired an unplanned litter.

It's irresponsible owners who are the problem along with the breeders for money
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Wolfwitch
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01-11-2014, 10:58 AM
Originally Posted by JoedeeUK View Post
It's irresponsible owners who are the problem along with the breeders for money
Whilst the sad reality is that a lot of dog owners out there do not fall under category "responsible owners" and I would never advocate not spaying animals, I agree with this statement. There is a lot of recent research out there that indicate there are a lot of other long-term health issues related to spaying and neutering. I always go with the theory that nature doesn't get things wrong very often and everything in our and our dogs bodies serves a purpose. They are starting to come around from this idea that spaying is preferable to the chance of a bitch possibly developing cancer etc. The majority of my many dogs over the years have been bitches, all intact and never had any surprise litters. But yes, you only have to watch one dog rescue program to realise what a huge issue dog population getting out of control is and that spaying is the only option. Hell, we can't even control our own breeding, never minds our pet's
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Malka
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01-11-2014, 11:33 AM
[quote=Wolfwitch;2840538]...[snip]...
I always go with the theory that nature doesn't get things wrong very often and everything in our and our dogs bodies serves a purpose. They are starting to come around from this idea that spaying is preferable to the chance of a bitch possibly developing cancer etc.
I do not like to disagree with you but anyone who has had an un-spayed bitch suffer and or die from pyometria, will not hesitate to disagree with you.

And I, like many other human females, were relieved of years of pain and/or life-threatening health problems by having hysterectomies.

Because nature does, actually, frequently get things wrong.

Spaying a bitch is not just about making sure that there are no unwanted litters, as anyone who has seen an intact bitch suffering from pyometria and/or mammary cancer will tell you.

As will the families of humans whose mothers/sisters/daughters died from cervical and/or ovarian cancer.
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lovemybull
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01-11-2014, 04:38 PM
I also tend to disagree to an extent as well. I've only been a dog person for a decade, a cat owner forever...but I feel neutering can change the male personality in both dogs and cats in a good way. More even keel and docile particularly around other males. In the past we cared for a few unspayed female cats. When they were in heat their frustration was audible, then female dogs bleed besides.
Without argument I feel that spaying and neutering across the board is a good thing.
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Wolfwitch
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01-11-2014, 05:33 PM
Originally Posted by Malka View Post

And I, like many other human females, were relieved of years of pain and/or life-threatening health problems by having hysterectomies.

Because nature does, actually, frequently get things wrong.

Spaying a bitch is not just about making sure that there are no unwanted litters, as anyone who has seen an intact bitch suffering from pyometria and/or mammary cancer will tell you.

As will the families of humans whose mothers/sisters/daughters died from cervical and/or ovarian cancer.
I appreciate what you are saying, Malka, but if you'll permit me to play devil's advocate here for a second: We don't remove the reproductive organs in humans to preempt them having ovarian cancer or anything related, so why would it make sense to operate on a healthy animal "just in case", that is all I'm saying.

This is one of those discussions that is going to have many different perspectives, depending on your personal experience I would imagine.

And of course it is horrible for both humans and dogs to suffer from anything like this and it seems like the obvious choice to make for a dog if you know she will never have puppies, especially with the wide spread - if somewhat outdated - perception that it does not harm the dog.

I guess I would just like it to not be the default standard for privately owned dogs but an educated choice

Have a look at this as well to see where I'm coming from

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=enPCZA1WFKY
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Malka
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01-11-2014, 05:48 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfwitch View Post
I appreciate what you are saying, Malka, but if you'll permit me to play devil's advocate here for a second: We don't remove the reproductive organs in humans to preempt them having ovarian cancer or anything related, so why would it make sense to operate on a healthy animal "just in case", that is all I'm saying.
Actually you are incorrect. A number of high profile women have had double mastectomies and hysterectomies due to carrying the mutated BRCA2 gene which can give an 80% chance of developing breast cancer and a 30% chance of developing ovarian cancer.
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halfpenny
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01-11-2014, 06:41 PM
I often find it funny that people who are against neutering their dogs, would still happily neuter their cats, castrate stallions and any other potentially difficult male animal.
Women do not get neutered but do pump their bodies full of chemicals to prevent pregnancy.
Luckily for humans pregnancy can be avoided while still having sex and an awful lot more effort goes into saving them if they get any type of reproductive ( or any other) cancer.
I have 13 rescue dogs here, I dread to think what kind of damage would occur with fighting and doubt I could keep them all together of they were not neutered.

I recently took in 2 old Shetland pony stallions ( one is 21 and one is 34), they are too old to neuter but its a nightmare keeping them away from any mares and every time they go out we have a dominance struggle. I know dogs are not the same but if the theory is we do not neuter because its only at our convenience (which is true ) many animals would either spend their lives locked up or culled as its too impractical to keep them entire.
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