Feeling guilty..

I did start writing this the early hours of this morning, as I couldn't sleep, but the OH made me go to bed. and told me to carry on when I'd had some sleep.

As anyone will know, I set up a group walk yesterday, not a lot of people turned up but I'm glad they didn't now. The majority of the members were from another forum.

Louie was attacked, harassed and bullied on yesterdays walk.

I wish I had said more and demanded more of an apology from the owner of the dogs who attacked him, he was defending himself after they'd both postured up to him and then the final straw was when one of them decided to get up on his shoulders.

Louie has never fought with another dog before, not like that. It was horrible for me to see and I feel terrible. One of the dogs just got up on his shoulders, Louie told him of his obvious discomfort and tried to move, then the dog had him by the ear and on the floor and was shaking him. When the dog was gotten off him, he moved and bumped into their other dog which had a go at him luckily it was just grumbling and that was over within seconds.

Although Louie only has a nick on his ear - even through from what it looked like you'd expect more, I can't believe I let it happen. I can't believe they let it happen. I'm not going to lie, I did ask how they were with other dogs before we got on the walk, due to their breeds. I do love both breeds but I am weary of them around my dogs because they aren't known for their friendliness towards other dogs. Anyway I was assured that they would be fine.

Well this is the first time I've cried since it happened..
Thats the last time I trust anyone's word about their dogs. Which is sad, because I really thought they were sensible and knew their dogs well.

I didn't get much of an apology from them, just an "Is he alright?" and tbh I didn't see blood at first so I thought there's no harm done. Then after it had happened and the dogs were split apart and on lead, I held back a bit, one of the other walkers asked "Did someone get a bit excited there?" to which the owner of the aggressors said "He doesn't like it when other dogs growl at him".

I'm pretty sure Louie doesn't like being dominated when he's just getting on with his walk. Louie had to be kept on lead the rest of the walk - which is stupid because it's one of his favourites and mine because he is safe there and he can do his own thing and not get into trouble. And I wish I had more balls to have said it to them yesterday but they just left their dogs off, they didn't seem to realise their dogs were the ones who started it. Yet their dogs were forever being told by them to stop "winding the dogs up" and they didn't do anything about it. It ended up me being at least 10ft behind everyone else - and I organised the walk.

One of the other walkers tried to excuse the other dogs saying "It's what happens when you have an entire dog". Urm no it isn't. Louie has walked with plenty of entire and neutered males - of many kinds of breeds and has never had another dog attack him nor attacked them. Thats a pathetic excuse for a dogs behaviour IMO.

Anyway - feeling a little less bad about the whole thing now I have let it all out. Feel free to judge - I know a few of you will. But don't expect me to reply to you, I feel bad enough as it is.

Just to let you know - this has not tainted my view on the breeds in question, but more of their owners and members of the other forum.

I bet you're absolutely fuming!! I know I would be.

It's one of the reasons I don't do the whole dog walk scene. Too many numpties out there so I would have to know the dogs and owners pretty well before I decided to go on one

I know, I'd messaged her a while though - I wanted to check her dogs were going to be alright, one of them was entire and the other neutered.

Since Pennie will be joining us in a few months I've decided it'd be best to walk with the same people I know and know their dogs. I was going to take her yesterday and carry her most of the way around, glad I didn't take her now.

I'm not fuming as so much upset. The owner of the dogs who attacked Louie posted her pictures up and said that they'd let ****** (I don't want to mention names etc - it's not fair) offlead and he was "bloody brilliant" - it's not the description I would've given his behaviour.

But todays another day. Just hope I'll sleep better tonight. ..

Oh Aimee, please don't give yourself a hard time. I completely know where you are coming from - Molly was attacked on a breed group 'walk' when she was 13 weeks old by an adult male GSD. I too was assured that Molly would be safe. It happened very quickly and totally unprovoked. Although the owner apologised (and was clearly upset by it) the blame was aimed at a dog that wasn't even there for winding him up!

I felt so guilty that I had let her down and for putting her in a vulnerable situation. I feared that the experience had 'messed her up', that she wouldn't forget the experience.

What happened can't be changed. What we can do is learn from the experience.

I'm so sorry that you have gone through the same. Nothing can excuse the attitude of the other dogs' owners. I cut the links to the owners I had issues with.

If you want to socialise Louie with a dog that is truly friendly, with no malice whatsoever, give me a shout, we're only an hour away. I know it's not Louie that has the issues but a good experience with another dog will help you both. x

I can imagine how upset/miffed/embarrassed/disappointed you are. But what I can't imagine is me ever wanting to organise for my dog to meet a load of strange dogs to go for a walk with? Perhaps if it was a Breed Club thing - well, maybe.

Takes long enough to get to know a few local walkers and their dogs and find out which of them all rub along OK.

I've never met anyone who had an aggressive dog yet who didn't 'make excuses' for it or come out with lame stuff like ' only wants to play' or the other old chestnut 'is she on heat'? (my dog is spayed anyway) and the favourite 'well - he's never done that before!)

I'm not taking my usual walking route at the moment - I was away from it for 2 wks and when I got back I noticed LOTS of very huge piles of dog doo along it (most unusual all the regulars have medium sized dogs) so there must be some very big new dogs going there and I've been told there is a huge aggressive black dog on the loose in the neighbourhood that has attacked a couple of people with their dogs. So for now - I am walking where I have a good and wide line of vision - away from the low hedges - down along the seafront and boardwalks.

This morning wasn't great walking through the deserted streets to the sea - first street dog we met looked mangy and I was having a job to keep him away. Next one we met (a little pug) was constantly coughing! (Arghhh!)

Anyway time for her second favourit thing now - dossing in the sunshine!

Put this experience BEHIND you! You tried and it wasn't a success but that wasn't your fault. You are not going to miss people you didn't know before and who don't sound like the sort you'd choose for friends anyway.

I wouldn't get involved in discussing it with others who where there either - will only prolong the whole experience. Just put it down to experience and thank the lord your dog was not SERIOUSLY injured.

Thank you.

He should be alright, he has plenty of friends to walk with and I'm going to be selective on our next group walk, on here it isn't so bad, but the other forum I know who I can walk with - who's safe that is. But the other day he had a Lab try the same thing with him (this lab does it every time!) but thats another thread.

It was a forum meet, just to get to know a few people and tbh past walks have given me some new friends - especially when I don't really know many people around this area. And I am thankful for those walks now.

They didn't even make an excuse for their dogs behaviour - another member on the walk did - saying it was my dogs fault for being entire.. sorry but that dog that attacked him lives with an entire dog - it's got nothing to do with that. It was more the fact Louie defended himself rather than submitting to them and if Louie had nicked them I would be apologising all the same. But their dog started it and was throwing his weight around with all the other dogs too - trying to find out which one he could get away with it.

And I know it makes you feel GUILTY when you think you've been stupid enough to put your dog in danger just because others assured you that he would be fine and that their dogs were absolutely OK. I know how I've felt when it happened with Bella a few times. I felt I'd let her down. That I shouldn't have taken the word of complete strangers when it comes to her safety. And that I should have gone with my gut instinct or whatever it was that made me ask them if their dogs were OK in the first place.

But - probably the same as you - we want our dogs to socialize and aren't bothered about a bit of rough and tumble or boisterous play or them getting knocked sideways - that's not the same thing as actually being bitten or overpowered though.

SLB the incident I felt the worst about was when a GSD I've known for years before I had Bella (and who was JUST FINE with my old Cavalier KC Spaniel) went for her (now I've owned GSDs and I know if it meant to kill her or bite her it would have and no one could have stopped it).

But the thing is I just got the body language thing (you know when they suddenly 'dip their head'? and sort of start to look as if they are going to 'curve round'? ain't explaining this well!)

The owner - a breeder who has 3 of them - immediately started shouting he wouldn't hurt her (so did a couple of other people who were around and who also know these GSDs) but he DID go for her and he bowled her over and she was screaming and I couldn't actually SEE her at one point. Everyone then looked TOTALLY SHOCKED.

The owner then started beating the GSD hard with it's chain lead (that didn't help me to feel better about it).

Now, if he sees me and Bella - even 200 yrds away - he grabs hold of this particular GSD and I can see it is straining to go (the other 2 are fine with her - one of my probs is I can't tell which one it is in the distance).

However Bella CAN tell and stupid little Bella starts to bark like a loony whenever she spots this dog in the distance!

Anyway at the end of the day I know the fault was with the dog who went for her but I still blame myself for not going with my own instincts whatever any of them said (and however good it had been in the past with my timid little CKCS), because I didn't feel happy about the way the dog looked at her and I was right. I was facing his dog - he was behind it.

I'm just so glad it didn't put Bella off other bigger dogs. She still only barks at the only two dogs who've ever had a go at her (but hey you cannot cure stupid which is what I say to her when she does it)

What a horrible experience Glad Louie is ok.

DO NOT FEEL GUILTY! It's not your fault at all. You did everything you could to find out if there would be a problem. There is no way you could have thought anything other than what you were told.

I've met a few people via the internet. Some I have chatted to for ages before meeting and wondered why on earth I met them, some they have been exactly like they were on the internet and we have become friends. You just cannot tell how someone is going to be until you meet them face to face.

Just put it all behind you and move on.

Helen