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Location: Runcorn Cheshire UK
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 4,480
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11-08-2009, 07:50 PM
I can understand you not wanting to escalate the situation further by becoming invloved.I also understand your fear of SBT's My Poppy was attacked by one a few months back which left her with a nasty puncture/split in her foot.
Thing is there are so many lovely SBT's out there, it's the owners that should be railled for not taking the time to train or even look after them properly. There are just too many of these dogs now owned by numpties who look on them like weapons or to make them look 'ard!!!
I would report it to the police (the attack on your girlfriend) If both dogs were off lead then I would just put that down to experience,
Hope your all feeling better now.
x
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Location: Milton Keynes, England
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 333
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11-08-2009, 08:10 PM
I would have said the police, however, knowing how ineffective they are in my area I wouldn't bother.
Let's put it this way...if that had happened to me or my wife, and it was an unprovoked attack on behalf of the other dog owners, let's just say I would be dealing with it.
I think that's the safest and politest way to put it on a public forum.
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Location: Sheffield
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 7,856
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11-08-2009, 08:55 PM
However...
Dogs growl - it doesn't necessarily mean aggression, it's what even very well socialised dogs do and serious dog fights result in serious injuries. They can look and sound a lot worse than they actually are. It's often very ritualised and as you had discovered, had the SBT wanted to injure your dog, he very easily could've.
I don't think you should worry too much about keeping your dog on a lead - what he did was communicate a desire not to interact with the SBT, probably because he had a ball and the SBT took it badly. This can happen, but, at least in our area, it's not so common. Again, it seems pretty ritualised if there was no actual contact.
I would, however, work on teaching your dog a command to drop a ball and, in the instance that you see another dog, you take control of the ball so that he doesn't need to protect it (try to do this before your dog sees the other dog so that he doesn't think he loses the ball each time a dog comes along).
I would also be looking at a charge of assault against the other dog owner if you have witnesses, however - I don't know how far you'll get as I didn't see the incident and therefore don't know how much your girlfriend reacted. If witnesses can state that she tried to talk the other woman down first, perhaps you will get somewhere?
Try to sleep on it, and look back on it with a clear mind to discover what actually happened (although your post was very well written!) but I don't think what your dog did was particularly aggressive. Any other dog would've taken heed of his warning and left the ball alone.
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Location: Dogsey and Worcestershire
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 49,483
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11-08-2009, 11:25 PM
Originally Posted by andymt 
Hello
However at the end of one of his walks today he was carrying a ball that we found. He seemed to display particular attraction towards it, as he ran away if I tried to take it from him. Soon after, he met what we later discovered was a staffordshire bull terrier. Rupert started growling and my girlfriend,who was accompanying me on the walk, grabbed his collar. The bull terrier responded in a similar fashion. Rupert started making lunges at the bull terrier, although they never actually made contact. At this point the bull terrier, who was also off the lead, started attacking Rupert and a fight broke out. My girlfriend at this point let go of Rupert's collar for fear of her hands. The owners of the other dog did nothing initially, and neither did I (I will explain why later.) Eventually though through the owners of the bull terrier managed to get their dog on the lead, and I followed suit with Rupert. The dogs were completely unscathed and none of us were hurt either, except from some minor scratches/bites on my girlfriend's hand.
However it was what happened next that concerned me most. The owners of the bull terrier started shouting abusive comments at me and my girlfriend, accusing us of lack of control over our dog among other things. They swore continuously, became increasingly aggressive despite my attempts to ask for a proper conversation. They called my girlfriend a "f*****g c**t." My girlfriend didn't respond aggressively, but tried to talk to her. However, a fight between one of the owners of the bull terrier and my girlfriend commenced, because one of the owners slapped my girlfriend. There was slapping, biting and hair tugging involved. I, and the other owner (who was also a woman) stood there; I didn't want to get involved with two girls fighting, and the other owner seemed to enjoy it. My girlfriend became trapped in a headlock and at which point the fight stopped. We continued to received abuse. I once more asked to have a civil conversation, but all I received was more swearing. There witnesses there who came over to us and checked we were OK. My girlfriend was unsurprisingly crying out of shock at this point.
I am extremely angry at the owners of the bull terrier, because they turned a dog fight into a human fight. Although I appreciated the severity of the situation, their reaction was out of control, even more so than that of the dogs.
I would like impartial opinions on the situation, and also advice on whether I should consider some immediate action on behalf of my dog, for example not letting him off the lead again for some time; i.e. is this first sign of violence something to worry about? I cannot forget that it was my dog who seemed to initiate the growling. Personally I suspect it was the ball he was carrying that caused him to feel overprotective and aggressive.
(Going back to the point above about why I was too scared to intervene: A few months ago whilst running with a group of people (without dogs) I saw a dog fight that resulted in a bull terrier mauling and killing a smaller dog, in what was a completely unprovoked attack. Despite the owners' attempts to separate the two dogs, including pulling them apart and kicking the bull terrier, they continued to fight and all that was left was a bloody mess. This incident scarred me and since then I have always been afraid of bull terriers.)
Thanks in advance,
Andrew
I think you did the right thing not getting involved in the fight between the humans , it may have caused the situation to escalate. I would certainly make a note of the details of the incident and inform the police although unless you know the people involved little can be done. It is still worth doing this in case the people involved make a habit of starting fights.
Now to Rupert, you say he is 7, has not been involved in other fights and both dogs were unscathed. Had this been a proper fight the dogs would not have been unscathed.
It sounds like a minor scuffle between the dogs and to me this does not signal that your dog suddenly has agression issues.
You also say when Rupert started growling your girlfriend grabbed his collar. If Ruper was feeling threatened in any way by the other dog (and growling is an indication he did or was guarding a possession ) , grabbing his collar although a natural reaction may have made Rupert feel he was unable to escape, he would also pick up on any fear or uncertainty your girlfriend may have been showing.
In a situation like this I would calm slip the lead on and turn away talking to Rupert in a normal voice , of course if you do this there is no guaranteed the other dog if off the lead won't attack, but this action can often diffuse the situation.
I would try not to dwell too much on one incident
I appreciated the previous incident may have coloured your view of a breed , but terrible incidents can happen with any breed and of course the larger or more powerful the breed the worse the outcome.
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Location: B'ham (nr the airport)
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,963
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12-08-2009, 03:22 AM
So sorry to hear of what happened - not so much with your dog but with your GF.
Fortunately your dog wasn't hurt and I'd follow the adcie already given so he doesn't become overly possessive over items (toys, treats etc) when another dog approaches.
More importantly, you definitely need to go to the police with your GF. You should both make a statement. She has suffered at the very least a s47 assault if she has gaps where her hair has been pulled out. The police have to investigate and ask them fo r acrime number. This way, they have to fill out a crime report also, and will most likely arrest the other woman concerned once they know who it is.
In the meantime, regain your confidence (& your GF's and dog's too) by walking elsewhere or go to a diffferent park. Once you ahve your confidence back then resume your usual walk. I don't really see why you shoul dbe the one's to go elsewhere but i's probably for the best to avoid any further confrontation.
Laura xx
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Location: Dogsey and Worcestershire
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 49,483
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12-08-2009, 08:24 AM
Originally Posted by andymt
.
However at the end of one of his walks today he was carrying a ball that we found. He seemed to display particular attraction towards it, as he ran away if I tried to take it from him. Soon after, he met what we later discovered was a staffordshire bull terrier. Rupert started growling and my girlfriend,who was Thanks in advance,
Andrew
one more point, you say Rupert found a ball and ran off when you tried to take it from him. You should be able to remove any object without a problem. Never chase a dog to retrieve an object you can't win 
Here is a video you may find helpful in teaching Rupert to drop an object. Once he has learnt to do this only give treats randomly then not at all but always give praise .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=GB&h...eature=related
If you do this and Rupert finds any other 'prize' when out for a walk you can then removed it before there is a problem
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Location: Somewhere
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,087
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12-08-2009, 10:21 AM
RE the dogs, it does sound from what you said that your dog started the incident by growling and the SBT didn't go in to attack mode immediately.
I own an SBT and I admit that they will not stand down if provoked by another dog. I'm not saying this as an excuse just something for you to be aware of if meeting an SBT you don't know.
If it happens again, I would suggest calmly putting the lead back on your dog, turn him around so he is not facing the other dog and walk away. Don't grab your dog or make sudden movements because that will provoke one or both dogs to go into fighting mode.
And like Mini says, try to learn how to get a ball etc. from your dog. I find using something tasty like cheese works very well.
HTH
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Location: Berkshire, UK
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 239
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12-08-2009, 11:12 AM
He wouldn't hit a woman either but I'm sure he would certainly have removed the other woman. I think you should report the assault on your girlfriend to the police. They won't do anything about dogs fighting but if this dog makes a habit of it then it's worth reporting it to the Dog Warden who will issue a warning that they could be charged with having a dangerous dog if it repeatedly attacks others.Unfortunately there is no law against stupid people owning dogs and alot of people haven't a clue that their dog's behaviour is not acceptable. Some might actually be proud that their dog is 'hard'. You meet a lot more stupid dog owners in the Summer unfortunately.
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Location: n/a
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 2,459
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12-08-2009, 12:54 PM
I'm not sure if I'd report to the Police though unless I had details of independent witnesses, as the other woman could claim that she acted in self-defence (dishonestly) and your girlfriend could end up arrested herself! Unfortunately, that's the way the Police work at times, so I'd be wary
If I were your girlfriend, I think I'd feel you'd pretty much let me down! Shock or not, I don't think I'd allow any of my loved ones to be attacked by somebody
Hope all of this doesn't affect your enjoyment of future walks
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