Sadly those are my feelings also.

I tried to give him the benefit of the doubt, but something did not add up, especially the way some of the dogs were reacting to his sly kicks and punches. (At least he has now admitted he does punch, on the AT show!).

Clearly there had been some "training" going on before the cameras rolled.

Then we see the videos from behind-the-scenes like the one where he uses a dog to wind up a dog aggressive dog. To do that is simply unethical and cruel, regardless of anything else.

Not to mention the dogs he has choked, pinned, rolled, and given no option but to "fight" him because that's what he thinks people want to see (and to be fair, a lot of people do, it makes them see him as a truly wonderful peroson apparently showing no harshness to the "red zone" dogs!).

To my mind, you cannot split the two - he is who he is, he isn't a wonderful special dog rehabilitator, he is a bully and a money grabber i am afraid

Wys
x

The reason a dog looks at you with a "What do you mean", ... sit? look,is probably because you have not taught HOW the dog to sit.

All the assertive calm upright stance in the world will still not teach your dog to sit.

One has to teach the dog what you wish it to do, NOT expect it to understand and act because you "claim this space " and act out being the alpha

And sadly this is why CM will remain popular with some, because they also buy into the dominance and alpha way of thinking.

CM has no empathy with dogs,he cant read body language, he is a bully and uses force to get results, and sadly to many people cannot see through the glare of the teeth to see the wood for the trees.

I cant understand how anyone can champion him in one breath, yet admit he gets it wrong on to many occasions

How can you still be a fan, when you see so many cases of abuse

Agree with this (and the teeth bit made me laugh).

Would I let CM near Guinness? No way in hell, Guinness would NEVER get over being treated like that. I would have him PTS before I let CM practice his cruelty on him. For me, that says it all.

I most certainly do not dominate my dogs. I am their protector, I feed them, keep them healthy, I exercise them and generally make them as happy and comfortable as I possibly can. In return, they give us their undying love, loyalty and companionship - and force us to take them out for walks in weather that only dog walkers would venture out in!

Myself and OH are pack leaders - my dogs look us to us both as such. If you choose to think that this is a load of nonsense, then that is your democratic right Joedee, but I choose to think otherwise.

I know my own dogs, as you know yours, and I see proof positive every day that my dogs are pack animals.

It's not just the stance. As you say, our stance is totally different to dogs - but it is the aura, the air of confidence that we give off when we stand in an erect posture, possibly with our hands on our hips that the dogs pick up on. The vibes that we give off - these invisible signs dogs do very definitely pick up on, and in particular the more wolfy breeds. Tones of voice are great - some people say it is the tone that dogs understand, not the actual words. I would disagree with this - my boys definitely understand words and phrases, not just tones - but I would concede that with some dogs it is just pure tone.

I laughed at your last sentence Ben! With Hal, we used to hear him when he tried (without success) to get up on one of the beds in our spare bedroom without us knowing. We would hear the slip of his claws on the laminate flooring as he jumped up. One of us would call up "H-a-a-l!" in a gentle but firm warning voice, and we would hear the chink of his name tag on his collar as he lifted his head, and the reluctant clatter of claws as he jumped down again, and the heavy flop accompanied by an equally heavy sigh as he flopped down on the rug! You reminded me of this.

That sort of approach would get you absolutely nowhere Azz with northern breeds, not in my experience. My old boy Hal would absolutely definitely have taken the ball away and possibly ended up eventually savaging anyone who trained him through force or mental or physical abuse. Ben would simply savage you, full stop, even now. He would not tolerate it. Tai would be the more reasonable, but eventually even he would end up aggressive, that I am certain of.

You totally do not understand Hal, Jackbox! With Hal, there had to be a reason to obey a command. This is a wolf thing - not just a Hal-ism! He was just plain not interested in pleasing us, his humans. Aloof was the understatement. By behaving as what he would recognise as a pack leader, an alpha, that DID make him sit up and think, and although he was ever reluctant at coming when he was called, sitting etc., he would do it, with a lot of curl tossing and in his own time.

Of course you can praise someone for their good aspects, and admit that they get some things wrong also. I cannot understand you saying that - we are all weak, feeble and frail human beings. We are all good or brilliant at some things, and crap at others. Take parenting - my daughter is grown up now, and has left home, but on the whole I did a pretty good job of bringing her up to be the beautiful, successful young lady that she is, even though she can still be a nightmare, and owes us £500!! However, I made lots of mistakes of course - like all parents. I could have spent more time with her when I worked from home, when she fell in the stable yard and broke her wrist, I could have actually believed that she had really hurt herself, rather than telling her to stop whingeing and muck out her pony!!

See what I mean? All animals, including humans, are a mixture of good and bad. We all make mistakes ... I wish CM would realise that he is not perfect, and get back on track and stop kicking dogs under the guise of nudging them.

Gnasher - it isnt a wolf thing - trainers still use reward based training on wolves
and cats - you cant get more indipendant than cats!
Hal is not a wolf, at best he is a wolf cross with way more dog in him than wolf
I appreciate you are happy with how you train and you believe you are seen as pack leaders. To be honest what we think our dogs see us as isnt really important to them so long as we treat them kindly, fairly and consistantly

and yes I totaly agree that everyone makes mistakes
The problem is CM is not saying these things are mistakes - they are his training methods that he uses again and again and shows on his TV show for others to copy him
He CHOOSES to kick punch zap and strangle dogs
He CHOOSES to wind them up and force them to react so he can have his 'man v's beast' vewer pulling in battles
He CHOOSES to make his followers think he is saving dogs where others wouldnt (many of his followers truly believe that positive trainers wouldnt take on any of these dogs) and he is very quiet and sneaky about the many times his methods dont work - even tho he still shows them on the TV as sucesses - JonBee, Shadow, the collie in the garage and even Holly were failed by him and have ended up rehomed - but he never mentioned that his methods didnt work in those episodes

I'm not here to get mixed up in a CM debate, but I've seen that exact statement several places, and I'm wondering whether people have any actual proof, or whether they're just guessing? I've known dogs that would react naturally to CM's nudging just like the dogs on the show, and I've known dogs that wouldn't notice you did anything if you threw a bucket of cold water on them.

But you don't have a wolf you have a xbreed .