Sorry Chaz, I didn't make myself clear. I know you were in charge I just wondered why you had been put in that position? Sad all round hun. Poor boy Not at all pleasant to be on the receiving end of either, poor Chaz A no win situation!!!

I was having to look after the children when the people caring for them had to go to a meeting about them, with the mother there, the mother is horrid, she actually moved back a road away to where they are staying without telling them, thinking that she could live in the same village as them without having to see them at all.

The mother of the kids has no family that would help, she herself was brought up in care, but had a foster family that she lived with, the boys dads have different problems, the recent one is on the sex offenders register, another one raised one boy from four, and beat him up, and the person that she was living with doesn't want to be involved with them.

The boys are a nightmare though, but it isn't their fault, the mother wouldn't fed them, on school days they would have free school dinners, other then that she told them to eat at other people's houses, or steal from the shops, they also steal toys from their friends or school. According to their teacher they are also mouthy at school, and regulary get themselves in trouble with other kids by shouting abuse at them, the bigger kids in their class hit them around a bit, but this is after these children shout things at them, including rasict remarks, and have been doing for a long time, so I can see why the other kids are getting fed up if whatever the teachers try it doesn't stop them, but then that makes the children I'm talking about shout more things, so its a viscous circle.

Are they in care then...the people looking after them foster carers
I ask as being a foster carer anyone we leave children with whilst at meetings have to be ''risk accessed'' and trained to deal with ''challanging behaviour'' which is what obviously these children are.
I am sorry too but I think it shouldn't been gone into in so much detail on here about thier lifestyle/parenting...regardless to how it maybe. Sorry thats just my opinion, as these children need understanding and help not judged and critisized........not being nasty just a thought

They are not currently in care, they are living with someone who is friends with the woman involved, this sort of thing also happened last year with my cousin with someone else, socail services seems round here to only get really involved if no-one else can step forward, and as someone has they back off a bit.

Well then Social services need to be contacted and have a sharp shock Im afraid, firstly Patrick and I are foster carers for children with mental health issues and challanging behaviour and neither are easy.

Your friend should be asking for appropiate training and costing, children with challanging behaviour need CAMS and cycology therapy, thier behaviour to them is perfectly normal due to how they have been parented, children like these (and we have one here now) take years to turn around and you need every bit of support that is out there/ mentor at schools, LACES involvement, one to one teachings, in some cases residential schools that deal solely in this area of behaviour, and the child comes back to the carer at weekends. Also training as to whether a contact is allowed with mother/supervised or not, getting help for the mother maybe a parenting/intelligence course.
Training for the person caring for them too, How to avoid confrontation, Dealing with confrontation outside the home, being an Appropiate adult, (which is very important if ever they get involved with the police) Health and Safety (again a must if she is caring for children that are not hers as its required by law) First Aid, Education pluses, Sexual abuse awareness (again very important) Recordings (all importate) Dealing with Allegations (again important incase the looked after child makes an allergation against her) Insurance for looking after other children in the home that is not your birth-child.........I could go on but I think your friend needs to think very clearly about looking after children without all these behind her as this can turn on her and leave her very unprotected without this training and certificates
I know if I hadn't the training that I have over the years I wouldn't like to be responsible for looking after any child with challanging behaviour or mental health problems.

I think your friend (if Social services are not involved) need to contact a MP and sort this out.

Thank you for all of that, I will pass it on and see what they think, I personally believe that with their issues that they do need help, the children defiantly need some help, that at the moment is not being provided for them. And hopefully soon socail services will be providing some help for all of the family, as the people that they are with have two young boys of their own too, and I think that they need consideration in all of this too, as they are too being affected by having these other kids in their house.

I would Birthchildren will always be affected, in the Foster care they can be trained/attend training, there are people that will speak to the birthchildren or monitor them to see if they are being effected and if they are the ''carer'' will be advised accordingly.

Also children that have had parenting issues/issues of abuse, will manifest itself at times in the way you describe, but they will hold an enormous amount of loyality to thier parents (well until they are old enough to acknowledge what happened to them) awareness of this is very important, as it is not unknown for children to blame a ''carer'' for abuse etc., rather than tell the truth that is was the parent.

So what I am trying to say your friend without the imput/training/support may think she is doing the ''mother and children'' a favour but in time if these children are seen by people in Authority as abused the children may turn and say it was her rather than tell on thier parents......its been known to happen.
Something that until proved otherwise can have a devastating effect on the carer and thier family.

I admire your friend for giving her time, but first and foremost she needs to make sure she is protected and so is her family.

Best wishes

Thanks again, I'll tell her this, and I'll really let her know how important all of this training is, and how it can protect her in the future if things go wrong.

I've talked to the people looking after the boys today, and theres more problems, and theres not any real support yet, they're struggling, money has become tight, emotions strained, the next bit is horrible to write, but when can someone accept that they've taken on more then they can handle? The oldest and youngest have settled in fine, the middle one hasn't hes told one of their children that he's going to get people to beat him up, hes becoming physical with the other children, he's even got up at night and gone into another room to hit a child who is sleeping.

Everyone around is dreading whats coming next they don't want to give up on this boy, but they lack in experience, social services are being contacted again tomorrow, but they are dragging their heels, saying he's better where he is. If they decide that they can't cope theres only one place for him atm, this is affecting the desiscion right now, because they feel responisble for his welfare. God I cant say how much I hate the whole mess