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Strangechilde
Dogsey Senior
Strangechilde is offline  
Location: Scotland, UK
Joined: Mar 2011
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Female 
 
05-03-2015, 01:27 AM
Originally Posted by streetmutt View Post
Wow! Thank you Strangechilde and PONlady, I will definitely give them both a go! Strangechilde how long after pericardial effusion did any problems 're occur if at all?
Berkeley had his first collapse in late summer of 2012. He recovered reasonably well within a few days, and while we were in France at the time, we were heading home soon and decided to wait to get him thorough scans that aren't available at our local vet in Thiviers. The vets took 350 ml of fluid off his heart. Ultrasounds showed a lesion on his pericardium that was initially diagnosed as haemangiosarcoma. It turned out not to be that, though, and as he continued to effuse into his pericardium we decided to go ahead with surgery to have the pericardium removed. There was no cancer at all-- the pericardium had hardened and there was a lot of scar tissue there, the worst the surgeon had seen, she said, but with the pericardium out of the way the fluid could just go out into the chest cavity to be reabsorbed and not squash his heart as it was doing.

Very recently he developed a cough, and our regular vet gave him a course of antibiotics and we got a humidifier, which seemed to help. But one day from completing his antibiotic course, he went very seriously downhill. We took him straight in and he was hospitalised for two days. They took 2.5 litres of fluid off his lungs and another litre the next day.

His formal diagnosis is ideopathic pleural effusion: basically, fluid is coming from somewhere, but where and why, we don't know. The test results from the lab showed some abnormal cells, but the vet doesn't think they are cancerous, but inflammatory. We can repeat the tests but in order to know for sure we'd have to open him up in a way he wouldn't survive, so we're going to be in the dark here. It's possible it could be a sort of cancer that lies flat in the pleura and never sheds any cells, so it's pretty much indetectable. Or it could be not that. We just don't know.

So, yes-- it has come back, but two and a half years later. On the whole, I believe the surgery was the right choice for Berkeley. He is bright and alert and happy even now while he's sick and he recovered brilliantly from the pericardiectomy. He's enjoying life (especially food) and has been able to go back to France, though his exercise is very restricted now. Of course, he is 15 years old now, so that'll be a factor too! He'll be going back to the vet school on the 12th and we will be able to talk with a surgeon about options for long term care, but anything will be palliative from here on. I'll let you know what they tell us if you like, but of course your own dog's case could be very different.

I hope that helps!
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streetmutt
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streetmutt is offline  
Location: lound suffolk uk
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05-03-2015, 09:00 PM
Thank you that's really interesting. Ruby had her collapse about 6 weeks ago, they had to drain her twice in the space of a few hours and she was left with ventricular arrhythmia. Echocardiogram showed a lesion on the right side of her heart and they said this was most probably haemangiosarcoma. We were going to have the pericardioctomy but they said she was at a high risk because of the arrhythmia and bleeding as tumour on heart. So after much thought we decided to bring her home and spend a couple of days with her as the prognosis was very poor.............six weeks on she is doing really well!! Acting as normal, perhaps getting a little more tired than normal? I can't believe how lucky I am to have my beloved Ruby still with me. We need to repeat an ecg to see what heart is doing. But perhaps we will also be lucky as this is not a haemangiosarcoma! It's so good to hear your boy is still doing well, 15yrs that's a brilliant age! Ruby is six years old. Thank you again and sending your boy lots of love.

Catherine and Ruby xx
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Strangechilde
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06-03-2015, 11:48 AM
I hope it isn't haemangiosarcoma! We lost our beloved big wolfy boy to that evil cancer when he was barely 7. Generally the first you ever become aware of them is when they rupture, which is what happened. It was on his spleen. A heroic emergency vet saved him by removing it, and she didn't see any more tumours while she was in there, but as she said that doesn't mean they aren't there. It's an incredibly aggressive cancer and it will spread. She gave us another month with Laszlo, but that was all he had.

If Ruby is doing well after 6 weeks, I'm hoping there's a good chance that it isn't haemangiosarcoma. It's difficult to identify a tumour just by looking at sonograms and ct scans-- there are limits to everything. With Berkeley there was a chance it could have been some other kind of tumour, so I asked our vet about chemo. She said that dogs tend to respond to it well and it's not nearly as awful for them as it is for us, as they don't give dosages to animals as high as they do for people, so they won't feel sick. Just in case that comes back as an option for you!

If Ruby is still effusing into her pericardium the fluid will be compressing her heart, so she'll naturally feel more tired than usual. You'll want to let her keep her own pace when it comes to exercise and not let her do anything to strenuous. I realise that carrying a Bull Mastiff up stairs is not really going to be an option, but if you can, keep stairs to a minimum as stair climbing can really put strain on her.

Another thing you'll want to look out for is any fluid building up in the abdomen. If the heart isn't working efficiently, pretty much nothing else is either, and the body's ability to get rid of excess fluids tanks out, and they gather in the abdomen. This can happen really very quickly-- like within days. It might be helpful, if you have a digital camera, to take a picture of her every day so that you can compare the images side by side-- helpful to your vet too. A heavy, distended belly is a sign of trouble, so do keep an eye out for it.

Good luck with your next scans! I hope you get good news! Please give Ruby a great big sloppy kiss from me!
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streetmutt
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07-03-2015, 10:07 AM
Thank you Strangechilde! You've given me a lot of help and plenty of hope. I will keep you updated.
Ruby sends a big slobbery kiss back!
Xx
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Strangechilde
Dogsey Senior
Strangechilde is offline  
Location: Scotland, UK
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08-03-2015, 02:09 AM
Thank you! All the best for you and yours!
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