Showing Neutered Dogs...

Does/has anyone showed a neutered dog, or more specifically a spayed bitch, and done well with it?

It may sound like a stupid question, but could a judge even tell if a bitch had been done anyway?

I show my bitches spayed and a judge has no clue - you do need to send a form to the KC and they send back a letter but no one ever asks to see it!

I know someone who does fwiw, and does very well with her [ Beardie ] including Showing at Crufts. She has never been asked her girls reproductive status in the ring to my knowledge.
I haven`t heard of any judges turning a bitch over to check for a scar, thats the only way they could tell and even then most scars are not visible :smt001

I believe the letter from the KC **acknowledging neuter is supposed to be carried `just in case` but someone with experience of it would be better answering really. I only responded because I know about the Beardie :smt001

**Contrary to common belief, [ and I did phone the KC about this a while back ], `permission` is not required from the KC to show a neutered dog, all it requires is for an owner to fill in a form confirming it has been done and the KC send back letter of acknowledgement.

I am not sure why its that way as its not like the KC could force anyone to use their Show dog for breeding so they really have no right to any say in it, [ and I do think the misinterpretation many have about `permission` has / does put people off neutering ].

I do think the only relevence it should have is with cryptorchid dogs as it is a hereditary condition therefore such dogs should not be bred from and are, in that respect, not good examples of their breed.

Before anyone jumps on me about breed Standards all saying
"Male animals should have two apparently normal testicles fully descended into the scrotum", thats only relevent when they are present, [ to make sure they are healthy ], but does not apply when snipped. The KC did tell me judges should not mark down because of neuter / spay.

I do think its time Breed Standards were updated, its been years since Show`ing neutered dogs [ either gender ], was likely to make laaaydee`s faint at the very notion

[ Thats me going off on one as usual, sorreeeeee ]

I though you we discouraged from showing a spayed dog as the whole point of shoiwing was to further the breed and thats impossible with a dog whos been castrated/spayed.
Also my understanding specially regarding dogs was they had to be certified entire before the op.
If im wrong patch please feel free to correct me

In the past yes, it was not permitted to show spayed/neutered, or chryptorchids but that did change some years ago. All that is required to show spayed bitches and neutered dogs is that the KC is informed. A letter is sent in return but this doesn't have to be produced at the show.

What may be of use though, is a letter from the vet practice stating that the dog was entire before the operation. Some judges do penalise neuters heavily but the letter may help with others.

"The KC did tell me judges should not mark down because of neuter / spay."

Patch, you are mistaken on this. I do believe you have misunderstood or been misinformed. Please recheck.

Judges are a law unto themselves.

No, the object of showing is a beauty competition and nothing else. There is absolutely no mention of breeding whatsoever, how can there be when some dogs are infertile, some bitches are baron, some males never used at stud and some bitches never bred from. You do not have to say a dog is entire either before they are neutered.

To answer the OP question, my bitch is spayed due to a closed Pyo, she has won her stud book number and a reserve CC.
Dawn.

Ah yes..... not saying a dog has to have been entire to show, but a letter stating such, does at least tell the judge that the dog did conform to the standard before castration.

At one time, it was against KC rules to actually show a chryptorchid.

Thanx guys, am going to get my girls done. I did get Maddy with the intention of breeding from her but with her colitis (which I wouldn't wish upon any owner as it is a complete nightmare) and fear aggression (although the aggression was brought on by an attack and not genetics, it's still one heck of a bad reaction she's had from it compared to other dogs who've been attacked and I wouldn't want to risk passing the genetics on for 'bad reactions if attacked')....

And Dusty's front legs are a little too short, not that many would notice, but it does affect her topline and she's just not good enough to breed from, but I didn't get her with breeding in mind anyway so that isn't a problem.

I'm really heartbroken about how Maddy has turned out. I've been up the past few nights debating with myself about it, as apart from the problems mentioned she is a wonderful example of a Weim, she's put together really well and moves beautifully, but I know it's for the best. Some things you just can't see in a 2 week old pup how it may turn out so it's shame.

With bitches judges can't tell. At one time speyed bitches had to have either been spayed for health reasons or have live progeny registered with the KC but the rules have changed I believe. I know we had a champion bitch in GSDs who had had to be speyed as a youngster with a pyo but none of the judges who put her up were aware of her speying, & some that were aware really knocked her for it. As for males I know of very few judges who would put up a dog rhat was not entire, even with a note from the vet & KC. I had a dog who had to have a tooth removed in his bite after an accident. We had letters from a vet & the KC & actually had the tooth but 9 out of 10 judges knocked us to the back of the line for this. The judges decision is final & this was a dog who prior to this had been in the prize cards at Crufts. When asked the judges said it was the tooth that affected their decision & it was the dog on that day they were judging. When I had my bitch spayed after her litter I notified the KC but I have to admit I kept quiet about it round the ring.