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Kelly7
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06-06-2005, 10:04 PM
My view on this is that I think EVERYONE, whatever their crime, deserves to be given a quick and fair trial rather than being held in limbo like they have. I'm not saying i neccesarily believe they're all innocent, and I dont doubt that some of those released could have come back here and lied about their treatment. But what if they're not lying? None of us really knows for sure. But the point is until they have a trial, no-one can say whether they're definitely guilty or not. The whole crux about the geneva convention is that it applies to everyone, from the most innocent person to the worst criminal. and like Graeme said, we should be setting an example.

Aloha - this might be a stupid question but what does the 6000 refer to?
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Alohacorso
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07-06-2005, 01:15 AM
Originally Posted by Kelly7
My view on this is that I think EVERYONE, whatever their crime, deserves to be given a quick and fair trial rather than being held in limbo like they have. I'm not saying i neccesarily believe they're all innocent, and I dont doubt that some of those released could have come back here and lied about their treatment. But what if they're not lying? None of us really knows for sure. But the point is until they have a trial, no-one can say whether they're definitely guilty or not. The whole crux about the geneva convention is that it applies to everyone, from the most innocent person to the worst criminal. and like Graeme said, we should be setting an example.

Aloha - this might be a stupid question but what does the 6000 refer to?
The September 11th tragedy which was the catalyst for our country to become involved in a war in Iraq.
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Alohacorso
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07-06-2005, 01:17 AM
I'm sorry...I have just been told by my OH that the number is closer to 3,000. It's 2,996 to be exact. Once again I apologize for my error.
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Abbas_786
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07-06-2005, 08:24 AM
Originally Posted by craig
i still dont think that the british people were inosent, they just could not prove their conections, i meen what were they doing in that country during the conflict site seeing.
and having loud music played to deprive them of sleep is still far better than having your head cut off with a knife,
I no what u mean craig i think some of the guys that did get realesed were infact at most fighting american troops but the FACT here is they were charged and tired with NOTHING and since we live in a fair country people are always innocent untill proven with out any doubt to be otherwise and in this case and in the case of over 100others so far released they have not been charged with anything so they were all held when they were really innocent. You also mention about rather be in theyre place then have your head cut off, there are recent US reports from inside the base that suggest that they have alot of sucide attempts by detainees, which seems to say that they would rather die than go through the treatment they are going through. Also a comment was made by some on here

The September 11th tragedy which was the catalyst for our country to become involved in a war in Iraq.

Well i dont think 9/11 had anything to do with the iraq war as none of the 19hijackers were from Iraq nor had any ties with the country the group they belong to hated Saddam just as much as america hated Saddam so i dont think it was anything do with the war on terror as after 15years of sanctions iraq was hardly a threat america or for that matter any1 else in the world. The pretext of the war was WMD's which later became getting rid of Saddam and which has now become freeing the iraqi people. 9/11 was a very dark day it changed the world some people carried out a very very sick act and will be held accountable by God! 3,000 innocent people died that day but this does not excuse the 100,000 innocent people that have died in iraq due to US bombing etc In my eyes the life of an innocent iraqi hold the same value as the life of an innocent american no single nations nationals lives are worth more than another we are all human and our lives and bloody is the same. Camp X Ray is just breeding more hatered towards america and its people. Im sure some of the people there are gulity and are bad people but i think they should be now send to trial theyve had 3years to get a case against these people i dont believe in stripping people of theyre most basic human rights for so long and subjecting them to this kind of treatment when you havent even told them why they are there! If america wants to police the world it is going the wrong way about it, they should be setting a good example not acting like the animals which they say the are keeping there.
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Abbas_786
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07-06-2005, 08:26 AM
Originally Posted by Hayley SBT
if they are proven to be terroists then i dont think they should expect to have been treated fairly! im sorry if every disgrees but anyone whos blows themselves up to kill other people are sick in my eyes!
Also i would like to say they have not been proven to be anything as of yet they being held with trial and legal and have been held for over 3years now. As far as they law is conerned they are legally innocent and have yet to even be charged with anything with most of them not even have been told why they have been held there so long.
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Hoggett
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07-06-2005, 10:33 AM
I think that if these people were so innocent then the EU and NATO ( or someone)would have stepped in to release these people. In my view the world is a little bit safer with those people being held there.

Ian
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Kelly7
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07-06-2005, 10:42 AM
Originally Posted by Abbas_786
Well i dont think 9/11 had anything to do with the iraq war as none of the 19hijackers were from Iraq nor had any ties with the country the group they belong to hated Saddam just as much as america hated Saddam so i dont think it was anything do with the war on terror as after 15years of sanctions iraq was hardly a threat america or for that matter any1 else in the world. The pretext of the war was WMD's which later became getting rid of Saddam and which has now become freeing the iraqi people. 9/11 was a very dark day it changed the world some people carried out a very very sick act and will be held accountable by God! 3,000 innocent people died that day but this does not excuse the 100,000 innocent people that have died in iraq due to US bombing etc In my eyes the life of an innocent iraqi hold the same value as the life of an innocent american no single nations nationals lives are worth more than another
I agree with you abbas. I wonder if deep down some of us in this country really do value the lives of Iraqis as less worthy than our own? I think that feeling hasn't yet died out (and our stupid press doesnt help the situation) but it's completely wrong in my opionion.

Also its funny how people are forgetting that in the run up to the war bush (and blair) were telling saddam he could avoid being attacked if he showed us his WMD's. Now there saying that regme change was the reason too. Think about it - it doesnt match up does it? The more we're hearing now (esp that official memo from 2002 here plus all the other lies) the more i believe this was planned for other reasons all along and sept 11 WMD's just provided a convenient selling point for it.
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Abbas_786
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07-06-2005, 10:59 AM
Originally Posted by Hoggett
I think that if these people were so innocent then the EU and NATO ( or someone)would have stepped in to release these people. In my view the world is a little bit safer with those people being held there.

Ian
Well since the US has given them enemy combantant status they are not covered under the convetions thus making it very very hard for the EU/NATO to do anything legally to have the proccess quickened or released also since they are in cuba US human rights courts do not have rights there so what the US gov has done is very smart if you want to keep people like this for a very long time without trial and get away with it im not saying they are all innocent etc all im saying is no matter who you are you should be given basic human rights no matter how great a crime you have done you have a right to defend yourself.

wonder if deep down some of us in this country really do value the lives of Iraqis as less worthy than our own? I think that feeling hasn't yet died out (and our stupid press doesnt help the situation) but it's completely wrong in my opionion.

Also its funny how people are forgetting that in the run up to the war bush (and blair) were telling saddam he could avoid being attacked if he showed us his WMD's. Now there saying that regme change was the reason too

good point i think the US/UK whole case was based at 1st around a UN resalution which iraq was breaching (not letting in weapons inspectors) when they did let them in and it became clear they didnt have them then said iraq is in breach of 12other UN rulings (which they were) and this is why we want to attack but if a country should be attacked cuz they break UN rules then Israel should logically be attacked they have WMD's and Nukes and have never allowed in weapons inspectors and also have breached 36 UN rules more than double what iraq did but instead of sanctions they are given £10million a day in US aid
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craig
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07-06-2005, 04:55 PM
Originally Posted by Abbas_786
I no what u mean craig i think some of the guys that did get realesed were infact at most fighting american troops but the FACT here is they were charged and tired with NOTHING and since we live in a fair country people are always innocent untill proven with out any doubt to be otherwise and in this case and in the case of over 100others so far released they have not been charged with anything so they were all held when they were really innocent. You also mention about rather be in theyre place then have your head cut off, there are recent US reports from inside the base that suggest that they have alot of sucide attempts by detainees, which seems to say that they would rather die than go through the treatment they are going through. Also a comment was made by some on here

The September 11th tragedy which was the catalyst for our country to become involved in a war in Iraq.

Well i dont think 9/11 had anything to do with the iraq war as none of the 19hijackers were from Iraq nor had any ties with the country the group they belong to hated Saddam just as much as america hated Saddam so i dont think it was anything do with the war on terror as after 15years of sanctions iraq was hardly a threat america or for that matter any1 else in the world. The pretext of the war was WMD's which later became getting rid of Saddam and which has now become freeing the iraqi people. 9/11 was a very dark day it changed the world some people carried out a very very sick act and will be held accountable by God! 3,000 innocent people died that day but this does not excuse the 100,000 innocent people that have died in iraq due to US bombing etc In my eyes the life of an innocent iraqi hold the same value as the life of an innocent american no single nations nationals lives are worth more than another we are all human and our lives and bloody is the same. Camp X Ray is just breeding more hatered towards america and its people. Im sure some of the people there are gulity and are bad people but i think they should be now send to trial theyve had 3years to get a case against these people i dont believe in stripping people of theyre most basic human rights for so long and subjecting them to this kind of treatment when you havent even told them why they are there! If america wants to police the world it is going the wrong way about it, they should be setting a good example not acting like the animals which they say the are keeping there.
i think that the british ones should not have been allowed back into this country and make stay in the country that they wonted to fight for as it must be the one that they love, reports from every prison say people try to kill them selfs. i agree with 911 had very little to do with the iraq war it was more abot oil,
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Hoggett
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07-06-2005, 06:28 PM
Regarding WMD, I still think they have them, I think he has huge underground bunkers that's why we can't find, because for example where are all these explosives and guns coming from? I think he (Saddam) still has hundreds or may be thousands of tons of explosive hidden.

Ian
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