Perhaps it's me I am confused again. So Ben is fine with other dogs and only kicks off with DA dogs ? Could it be he is just defending himself ? you are going to try and train that out of him ? Apologies if I have that wrong.

My husband and me too both weigh less than the 2 dogs. So OH walks them on 2 leads that run off a harness contraption that goes round his waist. The leads are on bungees and solid bits as well. so it doesn't matter how hard they pull, they would have to take him with them. OH would not be able to hold them just on traditional leads.

We have achieved a PEFECT RECALL with Ben using the e collar. Let us take the scenario that Ben and Tai are off lead, and suddenly a BL leaps out of thin air. OH calls out "Come!" in a very assertive voice, and Ben immediately stops, turns and comes back ... without having to be zapped. OH then clips him onto the harness, and Tai likewise. He now has control over the 2 dogs - most likely they will barking and lungeing at the BL - who hopefully by now has been captured by his owner - but he has sufficient control to stop a physical attack.

Perfect - this is all that we wanted to achieve. But as the icing on the cake, we feel it is worth trying to solve the BL issue.

Hence the stooge dog in the village.

No - sometimes he will kick off at another male dog who from our perspective is behaving perfectly normally, not showing any aggression towards Ben whatsoever. We are trying to read what it is that Ben is seeing which sometimes makes him kick off. He is not afraid, so it is not a defence thing. It seems to us that he is wanting to beat up the other dog because in his opinion it is doing something out of order, unruly, something that is "rude" in dog language!

No of course not. The dog would not be punished, it is the owners that are fined!!

But only if the owners were carrying the controller.

Nonsense, neither you or I know what that law would be as it isn't in place, your making it up now.

Clearly you know nothing about e collars. I was always taught that if you were going to discuss a subject you should know what you are talking about at the very least.

The dog continues to wear the collar - he does not know that you are not carrying the controller in your pocket. He knows that if he does not come back when you call out "Come" he will very likely get a zap.

A farmer friend of ours who has Woody, Ben's step brother, used an e collar to train Woody not to run off on shoots. Woody still wears the collar years later, but my friend no longer bothers to carry the controller. The collar is redundant, and most likely you could even remove the collar entirely. But for now Ben continues to wear his collar. OH carries the controller in his pocket just in case, but as I have said previously, he has not had to use it in a very long time.

No I am not!! I am assuming that the law in place in Wales would be used in England.

This thread is bringing up more questions than answers I am now wondering should anyone have a dog they cannot hold on a lead ? That seems incredibly dangerous whether the dog is friendly or not. Certainly not something I would consider doing.

Who were they and to which organisation did they belong

Did you take their advice to the letter and for how long, did you pursue follow up consultations?

You cannot make that assumption.