Blue eyes in dark coated dogs

Following a discussion myself anf Hali were having
We came up with something a little interesting and wondered if any people up on genetics knew about it

The fact that in the standard for a border collie blue eyes are not permitted
and we were discussing if that was because the blue eyes are associated with white factored dogs
http://abnormality.purpleflowers.net/genetics/eyes.htm
This very interesting link talks about a possibility that collies have the gene for a black and white dog to have bue eyes without it being the dilution effect of merle or white
However on this link
http://www.gis.net/~shepdog/BC_Museu...rEyeColor.html
There are some clearly black and white dogs with blue or odd coloured eyes

So does anyone know anything more of the genetics here

and does anyone know why blue eyes are not permitted in a black and white collie if there are no health issues associated with the blue eyes and it is a natural (albeit rare) colour combination

...it is not a blue eye.. its a wall eye(no pigment) as opposed to the sibe that actually has a blue eye like us.

eta..i was under the impression that traditionally shepherds do not like a 'light eye'

I though wall eye was eyes of different colours
But my point was genetically does the border collie have the gene for the blue eye - come of the photographs seem to say it does

Shepherds do have their fave looks
I know many dont like a white head as sheep are supposed to be more likely to challange them and they become harder dogs - but some like that, and some dont notice the difference
Some dont like a merle, some love them

So I guess as the blue eye is pretty rare then farmers may steer clear of them as they tend to stick with the 'look' they like and have done well with
But is not liking something a good enough reason for it to not be in the standard?

...what do u mean in photos? it looks blue but it is 'no pigment' and it is linked to the deaf thing...unlike sibes..you do not get deaf white blue eyed sibes.

http://www.gis.net/~shepdog/BC_Museu...rEyeColor.html
In the link
The deaf collies are the lethal whites associated with a merle to merle matings and they tend to have no white on their ears also
I mean the black and white dogs with no evidence of dilution who have blue eyes

I have heard one or two shepherds say they aren't keen on wall eyes, yet I haven't heard any definitive reason for not doing so. One shepherd did say that they thought a dog with a wall eye might not see its sheep so easily in sunlight, as it may have to squint into the sun, but having had two working dogs here with a wall eye, I have never noticed that myself.

Be interesting to find out the genetics behind it though. Our two wall eyed dogs (well they have one wall eye each) got theirs through their grandfather on the dam's side, Bobby Dalziel's Spot.

They were both from the first litter, but none of the pups in the repeat litter 2 years later have a wall eye. Interesting.

Fly



Tip




I have no idea about the KC breed standard for the collie tbh though, but know the ISDS have no probs with wall eyes.

Wall eyes aren't rare.

look at this lovely dark dog!

http://www.lookylooky.org/fly.htm

Im not sure of the genetics of it,

[QUOTE=Ben Mcfuzzylugs;2160695]I though wall eye was eyes of different colours
But my point was genetically does the border collie have the gene for the blue eye - come of the photographs seem to say it does

Shepherds do have their fave looks
I know many dont like a white head as sheep are supposed to be more likely to challange them and they become harder dogs - but some like that, and some dont notice the difference
Some dont like a merle, some love them

So I guess as the blue eye is pretty rare then farmers may steer clear of them as they tend to stick with the 'look' they like and have done well with
But is not liking something a good enough reason for it to not be in the standard?[/QUOTE]

You would have to ask the breed club and kennel club about that, not farmers/shepherds. As far as shepherds are concerned, there are no bad colours/coat/looks ... so long as the dog is capable of doing the job that is asked of it

Awww I waited for the page to load, but the photo of Fly wouldn't