Breeding show dogs..

....was talking to some one about breeding show dogs, the ethics behind It ect! when they said 'show people should ONLY ever breed from a dog that does well In the ring at a high level - So a dog that has 'proved' its self'.

Do you agree - Or do you think Its acceptable to breed from a dog with a minor breed fault, who hasnt/cant be shown or hasnt done well at champ shows, In the hope of bettering the off spring and producing show pups?


I hope your opinions will help me make my mind up about something! Im quite Intrested In what others feel about this...

Personally, I think you have to work with what you have, so long as the fault isn't detrimental to the dog, then I tink its fine.

What breeder will sell someone else the absolute best dog they have? Its highly unlikely.

The aim, in my opinion, is to produce dogs that are better than the parents, same way I think about the pigs I breed.

Yep, so long as you are using a sire which complements the dam I see no problem. Every dog has some faults, no matter what people tell you. Some dogs are a great specimen of their breed but don't enjoy showing (Dandy is an example). My Rio is a wonderful show girl, but lacks bone, so by putting her to a dog with plenty of bone, I hope to produce pups with her fab temperament and more bone. She may never win BOB at Crufts but she's still a nice bitch with a lot to offer.

In my mind, there is no such thing as a perfect dog, every single one will have a fault of some sort, according to the breed standard that is...could be light in eye, wrong pigmentation, the list is endless and somewhat unimportant to the health of the dog but would mean it was penalised in the show ring. If a dog has a health issue then I wouldn't use it in my breeding programme at all.

When I bred my litters I used dogs that I had shown and done well with at Championship show and open show level, the girls I bred from weren't shown purely due to my preference for showing dogs rather than bitches, but I knew they fitted the breed standard and would have done well had I wanted to show them.

All you can do is use the best that you can, and hope for the best...you can have two top winners that don't produce winning offspring.

All I would say is never double up on a fault as you are asking for trouble then.

Good luck with whatever you're planning

I agree there Is not perfect dog. Its what breeders aim for!
I was abit shocked when It was suggested that show people should only breed from dogs doing well at champ level or that could atleast go In the ring - and never breed or plan to breed from a dog that hasnt won or been In the ring..Some dogs are abit to big for the ring, according to the standard but nice In many other ways (Like My Karma)! But If you choose a stud In the hope to bring size down you could produce smaller pupsters...

Yes I think the aim should always be to improve on the parents and like with any mating, a stud should be picked that works well with the bitches faults and vis versa.

Thank You Scorpio

Well, personally I've always thought that health and temperament come first, but I thought that good breeders only bred to 'further their breed' ?

What I do wish is that breeders would consider the numbers in their own breed. I would be more sympathetic to someone who bred a dog with some faults (not health or temperament faults though) in a breed which was relatively few in numbers and in order to keep a diversity in lines. IMO with a 'common breed' there is no excuse to keep churning out 'run of the mill' dogs as this makes you no better than the pet owners who decide it's nice to have a litter from their pets.

I agree all dogs have faults so all dogs that go in the ring will also have faults.

So if you decide to breed from your dog it really depends on a number of things, but a dog should be looked at like it is judged as a whole package not just bits of parts stuck together.
When judging it supposed to be based on virtue rather than fault finding. The only faults that are stand alone are those that affect the health and well being of the dog.


But I hate it when I hear someone say she is no good for the ring so I will just breed from her.

I think there are an awful lot of nice dogs out there that never go into the ring, either the owners aren't interested in showing, or a number of other reasons, maybe lost a tooth due to an accident etc.

I like to think that I know my breeds well enough to look at a dog and know if it would compliment my bitch. Obviously I would need to look at the pedigree to check for the lines to make sure they were compatible/not too close before I used him.

I sometimes think that too much emphasis is placed on using the top winners..it shrinks the gene pool and, those of us that show, all know that it isn't necessarily the dog that is winning the prize

If I were breeding again, I would probably use my own stud dog again as I know the lines and what his temperament is like. However, if I didn't have a stud dog I would shop around until I found something I liked, regardless of whether he had been shown

It still Is breeding to better the breed. Health and tempermant Is Important and should come first I agree, But I also think confirmation ect Is mega Important to carry on bettering the breed! All dogs have faults some can be covered over or what not, the size of a dog could'nt Its still a fault If a dog Is to big, Yet It can be quite a simple thing to breed down If you choose to line breed I would have thought.

Like said before, even breeding two champions doesnt always mean you will get pups good enough to show, or be an improvement on their parents.
You would'nt be churning out 'run of the mill' pups - You would be Improving on what your dog lacks .... If done correctly.

But I think the fact that certain breeds are more common just shows that they're popular, well liked breeds. If reputable breeders only bred the more unusual breeds, e.g. Pulis, Anatolian Shepherds, etc. then where would all the dog owners wanting to get a Labrador, GSD, Jack Russell, etc. get their dogs from in 20 years time? If breeders stopped breeding those dogs today, in 20 years time their lines will have died out and the only source will be BYBs and accidental litters.
We need more breeders to breed these common breeds responsibly, and more people to be educated about the importance of researching and approaching a reputable breeder - so that in the future, people will shun BYBs and petshops and approach reputable breeders instead - and hopefully be more educated on spaying/neutering, or taking precautions with entire dogs, thus reducing the overpopulation of dogs by putting BYBs out of business and preventing accidental litters.