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Borderdawn
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08-03-2007, 10:25 PM
Originally Posted by Stamford View Post
I understand what you mean Luke,but to answer your question as far as im concerned there should not be any banned breeds in this or any other country.But i can't get into that here as this is not a BSL thread.
I think Luke has a point Stamford, the breed wouldnt be up for disscussion if they werent here. You may not think there should be any banned breeds, but you may have difficulty putting that across to those families and victims of horrendous attacks that these dogs have committed.
Dawn.
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Stamford
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08-03-2007, 10:31 PM
Originally Posted by Borderdawn View Post
I think Luke has a point Stamford, the breed wouldnt be up for disscussion if they werent here. You may not think there should be any banned breeds, but you may have difficulty putting that across to those families and victims of horrendous attacks that these dogs have committed.
Dawn.
I know Luke has a point Dawn.I wasn't trying to be bolshy,Just stating what i personally thought.As for putting my point to the families surely that would be the same for any breed that has attacked.I am not defending the dogs that have attacked neither am i defending the scum that use them for fighting.I am just saying that at the end of the day the banning was done in ignorance and i still think it should be revoked (although i know it won't be)
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Borderdawn
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08-03-2007, 10:34 PM
http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2007110125,00.html
This happened local to me yesterday. I know they are saying "staff" but some are saying "Pit Bull" can you understand how many people must feel about this type of dog when you see things like this?

You see, you might think, "well what was a young girl doing with a dog out like that?" but what was that dog doing behaving like that? especially when many people on here are backing up the impecable temperaments these dogs have? Something made it attack, something made it snap? Bad dog or bad owner?
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Borderdawn
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08-03-2007, 10:34 PM
Originally Posted by Stamford View Post
I know Luke has a point Dawn.I wasn't trying to be bolshy,Just stating what i personally thought.As for putting my point to the families surely that would be the same for any breed that has attacked.I am not defending the dogs that have attacked neither am i defending the scum that use them for fighting.I am just saying that at the end of the day the banning was done in ignorance and i still think it should be revoked (although i know it won't be)
Tis fine, I know where you are coming from
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Meg
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08-03-2007, 10:39 PM
Are Pit Bull Terriers Dangerous? Last week I would have said they were no more dangerous than any other breed, now as the result of looking into statistics I would say yes they are.

I have always believed that all dogs have a 'bite tolerance threshold' and that if this is exceeded due to one of a number of factors eg pain/fear/illness/hormones/heredity/poor socialisation any dog could bite. However it would seem there is a difference between the dogs who simply bite, and the dogs who have the potential to bite and cause fatalities, PBTs fall into the second category.

We are told by some that PBTs are extremely 'human friendly' and 'child friendly' , but what about PBTs that have never been socialise with children, are we to believed that this breed above all others is an exception and less likely to attack children than any other breed?

If so this is not born out by the statistics coming from the USA.

Looking at a ten year period in the USA the highest number of fatailities was caused by 'Pitbull type' 66 deaths in ten years.(Stats from a number of US agencies on page 2 ).

http://www.cdc.gov/ncipc/duip/dogbreeds.pdf


These statistics may not be conclusive because some attacks may never have been reported, but they do seem to be quite comprehensive.


In addition to this the Bite Law Center ,a network of Lawyers who have successfully represented clients who have been injured by dangerous dogs state...

Quote:
In one study it was reported that 42% of all dog related killings of human beings in the United States are caused by Pit Bulls attacks, yet Pit Bulls constitute only 2% of all dogs. 70% of those mauling deaths were of children.
Quote:
According to a large federal government study conducted "only" a third of the fatal dog attacks in the United States. This study also cited the disproportionate threat these dogs pose to children. Children, according to the study, are the most vulnerable victims in dog attacks, with those under the age of 14 accounting for 42 percent of all dog bite injuries. Most of the mauled victims are between the ages of five and nine.
It one also takes into account some of the people who are attracted to owning PBTs over any other breed, the type of people who may be less likely to treat the dog well or socialise it, breed from poor quality stock, breed to retain aggression we may have a reason why some PBTs have the potential to be more aggressive than some other breeds.
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Meganrose
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08-03-2007, 10:49 PM
Originally Posted by Minihaha View Post
Are Pit Bull Terriers Dangerous? Last week I would have said they were no more dangerous than any other breed, now as the result of looking into statistics I would say yes they are.

I have always believed that all dogs have a 'bite tolerance threshold' and that if this is exceeded due to one of a number of factors eg pain/fear/illness/hormones/heredity/poor socialisation any dog could bite. However it would seem there is a difference between the dogs who simply bite, and the dogs who have the potential to bite and cause fatalities, PBTs fall into the second category.

We are told by some that PBTs are extremely 'human friendly' and 'child friendly' , but what about PBTs that have never been socialise with children, are we to believed that this breed above all others is an exception and less likely to attack children than any other breed?

If so this is not born out by the statistics coming from the USA.

Looking at a ten year period in the USA the highest number of fatailities was caused by 'Pitbull type' 66 deaths in ten years.(Stats from a number of US agencies on page 2 ).

http://www.cdc.gov/ncipc/duip/dogbreeds.pdf


These statistics may not be conclusive because some attacks may never have been reported, but they do seem to be quite comprehensive.


In addition to this the Bite Law Center ,a network of Lawyers who have successfully represented clients who have been injured by dangerous dogs state...


It one also takes into account some of the people who are attracted to owning PBTs over any other breed, the type of people who may be less likely to treat the dog well or socialise it, breed from poor quality stock, breed to retain aggression we may have a reason why some PBTs have the potential to be more aggressive than some other breeds.
I'm so glad that you've pointed this out Mini as I too have been researching the data before commenting, as I have no real experience of Pit bulls and so felt unqualified to voice an opinion but, I am actually astounded by the facts that are emerging and I too would have to say that yes I do believe these dogs have the potential to be more aggressive than some other breeds.
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Meg
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08-03-2007, 11:08 PM
Originally Posted by Meganrose View Post
I'm so glad that you've pointed this out Mini as I too have been researching the data before commenting, as I have no real experience of Pit bulls and so felt unqualified to voice an opinion but, I am actually astounded by the facts that are emerging and I too would have to say that yes I do believe these dogs have the potential to be more aggressive than some other breeds.
Hi Meganrose I know a number of people feel the same but they will not express an opinion, perhaps they may feel they can do so now others have spoken
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Meganrose
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08-03-2007, 11:26 PM
Originally Posted by Minihaha View Post
Hi Meganrose I know a number of people feel the same but they will not express an opinion, perhaps they may feel they can do so now others have spoken
I do hope so Mini as I can't get the statistics out of my head, especially that 42% of deaths were caused by Pit Bulls, while they only constitute 2% of the breeds in that survey (and 70% of those fatalities were children ). It would pressumably follow then if there was a bigger population of PitBulls that we could expect the figure to rocket! It really doesn't bear thinking about.
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muttzrule
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09-03-2007, 02:21 AM
I don't believe that Pit Bulls are inherently dangerous, or any more dangerous than any other dog breed. My experience is based on Pit Bulls in the United States and I have worked extensively with the breed for the better part of my lifetime as a kennel worker, a veterinary technician and a dog trainer. My experience has been that pit bulls have no more a tendency towards aggression than Labradors or Terriers or any other breed. My position is that both nature and nuture are working towards the docile nature of this breed.
The vast majority of APBT and AmStaff breeders in the United States breed for sound temperment. (There will always be the unscrupulous byb or dogfighter that will purposefully or inadvertantly breed a more agressive dog) But by and large, the breed is being bred as a solid companion animal-not a fighting dog. That being said, I believe nature plays a much smaller role in a dogs temperment than nurture. I believe the way an animal is raised is a good 90% of how it behaves. A well socialized, properly trained "dog" of any breed, isn't going to be running rampant and attacking people and dogs.

I believe the Pit Bull is a victim of it's own strength. The PB that hasn't been properly trained and socilaized, that does bite, is more likely to cause a more serious injury or death than another breed due simply to the animals size and strenght. But Pit bulls are not killer dogs or devil dogs. They are quite pleasant animals, goofy, loveable, playful and friendly.

Big gun or small gun, it isn't the gun thats dangerous, its the person shooting it.
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muttzrule
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09-03-2007, 02:37 AM
Perhaps, but I think they are more likely to "snap" and be triggered by things that other dogs would see as "ok" The other problem with them is, switching them off once they start.
Can I ask where you get the idea that they will "snap" at something other dogs view as normal? Have you witnessed this behavior? Is there some study I am not aware of?





Can I ask, how many people participating in this thread have had actual hands on, day to day experience of Pit bull terriers?
In my 20 plus years of experience with dogs of all breeds including the Pit Bull Terrier, I have seen two Dobermans "turn" on their owners for no apparent reason, and one chow mix. Never a Pittie. Pit Bulls are extremely stable dogs. They aren't moody, they aren't flighty, they are normally gentle, solid and puppy like until their middle years. Pit bulls aren't prone to fear responses like some breeds as they simply don't have a fearful bone in their body. They live to explore their world. Things that might another dog "snap" is likely just to be something new and interesting for the Pit Bull to check out.
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