Have you approached the breeder to see if there's anything hereditary you need to consider?

I can also recommend hydrotherapy for strengthening muscles, especially where there are joint problems, such as hip dysplasia, arthritis. But do go to a qualified canine hydrotherapist as they will have a good understanding of anatomy, how the joints work, what is beneficial exercise for each different condition etc. They also monitor progress such as joint extension, they can tell if the legs are working evenly, they monitor heart rate & respiration & will devise a programme to gradually strengthen the muscles supporting the joints.

The benefits of hydrotherapy are that it is effectively weightless exercise so there is no pressure on the joint itself ~ especially good physiotherapy after an operation. Plus, the joint hangs down relatively loosely due to gravity so any detritus in the joint (which can cause a lot of pain) can be flushed out. It can also increase the range of movement in a joint & is also very good cardio-vascular exercise, so can help in weight loss as well.

One of my labs has hip dysplasia & has really benefitted from weekly hydrotherapy sessions. The hydrotherapist very kindly allows me to take my other lab who LOVES to swim & she just jumps in the pool & spends 30 mins chasing after tennis balls. Plus they both get showered off afterwards (& occasionally shampooed) & even get a biscuit!

Hi There
That is so sad to hear, when you go on walks, where abouts do you walk ie pavement, wooded area, as there could be somthing on your walk that irritates you pets legs, plus where abouts is you dog sleeping ie dog basket or dog sofa plese keep us posted.

hi thanks again for the comments!

i have been trying and im still trying to get a video of alfie when his legs are weak, he seems to think that when the camera comes out its a game and spends the whole time ither with his nose in the lense or trying to eat it

Dobermonkey i currently walk him on a halti, not because he's terrible on the lead, because he's not! but because he seems to think every other dog is there to be played with and will pull when he sees one, which obviously puts pressure on his back legs. Alfie doesnt realise there are some dogs that want to be friends and some dogs that dont do you think a harness would be better? also i didnt realise there were so many different glucosamine products i am now seeking out ones with a higher 'active' ingredients!

i have looked into hydrotherapy and would really like to give it a go, although im having the same problem as the specialist, the one iv found at the moment is 65miles one way and like i said befor Alfie really doesnt travel very well!!! another thing im worried about is he hates water! allways has since he was a baby, whenever we took him to a river he wouldnt even get his paws wet! if theres a puddle in the road he will stop dead and refuse to walk through it and if it was raining outside i would literally have to pick him up to take him out to the toilet! he has got a bit better and will go out in the rain but deep puddles are a still a no no
do you think that he would get used to it if i took him? i have read that it could be really good for him!

i spoke to the breeder when we got him and asked if there were any problems he knew of, he said there were none. (i guess this doesnt actually mean he was telling the truth tho)

As for walking him, he was being walked on grass but his nails were getting to long and i didnt want them to cause him discomfort so he is now being walked on a road. is there a surface that would be better for walking him on?

at the moment he has a soft bed with extra blankets because i want him to be comfy (although hes normally on the sofa curled up by me) i know hes not ment to jump but letting him just up once and go to sleep seemed better than me constantly getting him to jump down and when my backs turned him jump back up again, but again iv been looking into getting him a new bed but dont know what type would be better for him, the orthopedic ones iv looked at look so uncomfortable!

i was just wondering, he has had x-rays and they all came back clear, the only thing i remenber the vet saying was there seemed to be a hairline crack in one of the bones so they x-rayed the other side and in was exactly the same and the vet said it was a growth plate that hadnt yet connected properly, she also said she had shown the x-rays to the other vets and they also agreed that thats what it was, what i was wondering was can dogs get growth pains? could his problems be from the fact that his bones are still forming? and at what age would this stop? also if it was cruciate ligament damage wouldnt there be swelling and would that show up on x-rays? he doesnt seem to have any swelling or sign of injury what so ever! i can bend and push and feel every joint, toe and bone and he doesnt flinch! doesnt show any signs of pain or discomfort when i touch or press anywhere, its really strange! i think it would almost be better if he did have a cut or it did hurt him when i touched somewhere at least then i would know where the problem was!

Hi,

It's a shame the pool is so far away, is your vet able to recommend one? Don't worry about your dog not liking water, for some breeds it's not a natural thing but my dogs have really taken to it.

The hydrotherapy pools that concentrate on post op & medical conditions (as opposed to places that 'fun swim') normally put the dog in a harness & then they are lowered into the pool via a hoist so it is all very controlled.

Re; the cruciate, over the years 3 of my dogs have had this & none of them had swelling (only after the op!).

When your vet told you the xrays were clear what did they mean? When dogs are xrayed for hips/elbows for breeding purposes they are only done after 1 year old as their bones are still soft. I dont know what age the growth plates close in your breed, but in mine they are about 8 months. It is possible he has growing pains though, it is known as panosteitis and can move around from leg to leg causing a lot of discomfort.

If your insurance/funds allow you might get peace of mind by asking your vet to refer you to an ortho specialist who will better equipped than your vet to advise.

'Pano' (growing pains) can be caused by a diet too rich in protein which cause them to grow to quickly. the ideal is to grow them slowly to give everything else time to develop.

Out of interest, what do you feed Alfie?

Harness verus halti - hmm not too sure. They push into a harness, driving from behind which develops muscle. Halti they try to push and get turned losing purchase. I personally would use a harness for stability/support purposes but then i havent seen how hard he pulls to try to go and say hello (this coming from me who got pulled through a fence/wing at agility monday night and dragged over onto my front whilst attached to the boys harness as he raced to stick his nose up a labs bottom!)

i am going to ask my vets about the hydotherapy and a specialist, iv been back and forth there so often im sure they are getting sick of me (its not just alfie they're getting, i had a cat run over so iv been bck and forth with her aswell)! i havent had a chance to take him back again yet, im actually 8months pregnant aswell so things have been a little manic in my house! i know i shouldnt be making excuses tho! and if he was showing any signs of being in pain he would be there in a flash!

thanks for that Dobermonkey it really made me laugh!!! sounds like agility classes should come with a warning! Alfie doesnt tug so much as bounce (a bouncy pull if that makes sense) and he bounces on his back legs which the halti does stop him doing, but i can allways give a harness a go, at the moment its my husband doing all the walking as im finding it a little difficult to waddle with him so il invest in a harness, hand it over and ask for an update!


and with the food, he was on bakers when i got him and he had a very sensative stomach and everytime i started introducing a different food it would upset him, i have recently changed him to burns which has a low protein because i had read a diet in high protein was bad for them and he seems to be doing ok i just hope its not to late but i guess better late than never. when do dogs actually stop growing?

hi, just thought id update everyone on alfie. i took him to a different vets yesterday i decided i wanted a second oppinion and they were fantastic!!! i wasnt the best of news but it made me feel so much better speaking to someone who knew what they were talking about and at least now we know what we are dealing with!

basically she confirmed what i allready thought, it is his hock joints that are causing the problem, they are far to straight! she said that it isnt anything we have done or caused its just the way he's made. Because his bones are to straight the ligaments are having to work extra hard to keep the joint in place. There is nothing wrong with the ligaments its the bones that are the problem and therefor she doesnt sugest surgery because although you can change the ligaments you you cant change the bones. I asked if it would be causing him pain, and she said she doesnt think it is on the whole, the only time its going to cause him pain is when he twists it and stretches the ligaments even more, which he is more likely to do than other dogs again because the shape of his legs. She said when that happens i can get pain meds for him. She said everything we are doing is perfect and to carry on with the glucosamin because his condition is going to make him a high candidate for arthritis in the future and the glucosamin will help his condition now but also help prevent the arthritis as much as poss. She also said he's never going to ba able to do long hikes but short flat walks will be great for him. She has also told me about a hydrotherapy centre about 40 miles away which is much better than the 1 i found! although my poor man didnt even make it the 8miles to the vet without being sick

so although its not the best news in the world at least we now know whats wrong and can concentrate on making his life as happy as possible!

i am also going to get hold of the breeder because this is a problem with his making and not just something thats happened and no dog should have to go throught it! especially seen as he isnt even a yr old yet!

thankyou everyone for your help and support! youll never believe how much its helped to speak to other doggy people!!!

I'm glad that you've found the cause of the problem ~ it must be a great weight off your mind. Just shows that vets don't know everything!

I can remember when my lab first showed signs of pain in his back legs. The first vet showed hardly any interest, just said lead walks only for a week, gave me metacam & said come back in a week. When I went back I saw a locum vet who was fantastic. He spent a lot of time manipulating Barney's rear legs, then recommended xrays as he suspected hip dysplasia. The results showed he was correct & he then spent a lot of time with me explaining how best to deal with the problem & the prognosis for later years.

Whilst Barney is not particularly bothered by water & happily goes swimming/paddling in the sea & rivers, he does not willingly get into the hydrotherapy pool. Instead the hydrotherapist walks him backward down the ramp & she's in the water with him the whole time monitoring his exercise. I would be wary of a hydrotherapist that didn't go in the water with the dogs. Plus the water is quite warm (it feels like a sauna in the hydrotherapy room to me!) so it may feel quite different to your dog ~ quite unlike cold puddles & ponds!

Good luck with Alfie ~ I hope he makes good progress.