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catrinsparkles
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27-05-2013, 07:42 AM
Well it's more complex than alpha male, dominant or not. Is a more fluid changable thing depending on each situation, dog and lots of other factors. Here's some reading if you fancy it.

http://www.apbc.org.uk/articles/why-wont-dominance-die
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mjfromga
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27-05-2013, 09:10 AM
Originally Posted by catrinsparkles View Post
Well it's more complex than alpha male, dominant or not. Is a more fluid changable thing depending on each situation, dog and lots of other factors. Here's some reading if you fancy it.

http://www.apbc.org.uk/articles/why-wont-dominance-die
I read some of the article, thanks. The writer made this statement and then I kinda questioned the entire article:

"What we are witnessing in so-called “dominant” dogs is natural behaviour that has been modified through learning."

Why can't this "natural behavior" be dominance? Dogs in nature do display dominance, so it should be a possibility, right? He's acting as if dogs can't possibly display dominance.

I really don't agree with that. Not all gestures perceived as dominance are dominant, but it can happen. I read a bit further, he didn't mention humping, nipping, food aggression, or really anything specific from what I read (though I didn't read the entire thing and kind of skimmed).

These behaviors and tons of other behaviors are why dominance theories exist to begin with. If you're going to try debunking myths, you'll want to ensure you be as specific as possible.

He also doesn't really mention (from what I read) dominance with dogs. He's just randomly blabbering about random "science" studies etc. that have been done.

The article did quickly bore me, so maybe I just didn't read enough or read it well enough. I disliked the article.
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catrinsparkles
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27-05-2013, 09:21 AM
I don't think it's random science as there is a lot scientific research papers that you can read about it. The behaviours you mention, humping, nipping, food aggression can have so many different causes. Are old family dog humped, but was the most gentle well mannered dog you could find. Nipping a be puppy play, frustration, a behaviour that has been reinforced by the result it got...but doesn't mean the dog is trying to dominate. It does take deeper reading to really understand it, which is one reason I think dominace theory remains... a there's not much to read into it. ....it seems so simple...but it's not.
A dog can chose to resource certain things but not others, or only guard in certain situations or in the presence of certain people....it's more about the perceived value of the thing and the threat to it, which is completely variable....rather than a continued dominace structure.
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mjfromga
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27-05-2013, 11:34 AM
Originally Posted by catrinsparkles View Post
I don't think it's random science as there is a lot scientific research papers that you can read about it. The behaviours you mention, humping, nipping, food aggression can have so many different causes. Are old family dog humped, but was the most gentle well mannered dog you could find. Nipping a be puppy play, frustration, a behaviour that has been reinforced by the result it got...but doesn't mean the dog is trying to dominate. It does take deeper reading to really understand it, which is one reason I think dominace theory remains... a there's not much to read into it. ....it seems so simple...but it's not.
A dog can chose to resource certain things but not others, or only guard in certain situations or in the presence of certain people....it's more about the perceived value of the thing and the threat to it, which is completely variable....rather than a continued dominace structure.
I mean, I agree that the dominance theory is extremely washed up, but I do think that dogs can still display dominance towards humans. That article insinuated that it was impossible, which I don't agree with.
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Tang
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27-05-2013, 02:18 PM
Absolutely wonderful photos of your two. What a pleasure to see them. It's great to read that you crate the pup occasionally to give the older one a break from it.

I don't like dogs full on jumping all over me so can quite understand that some doggy senior ladies don't either! In fact when I've had big dogs - stopping them from jumping up at people was one of my main concerns from early on when training. Even if some people 'don't mind it' there might come the day when it will be a child or an adult who is terrified of dogs who is on the receiving end of a full on jumping up at them.

In Newlyn a very elderly frail neighbour was flattened by the lady next door's big black lurcher. Not a nasty dog but not well controlled either. The old lady was hospitalised with a crack to her elbow and bruises all over where she landed on the concrete path. 'He is just pleased to see you' didn't quite cut it on that occasion.

I don't go for all this 'alpha male' stuff myself - no experience of it and didn't even know much about it until I read quite a lot of stuff discounting it.
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catrinsparkles
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27-05-2013, 06:03 PM
Originally Posted by Tangutica View Post
Absolutely wonderful photos of your two. What a pleasure to see them. It's great to read that you crate the pup occasionally to give the older one a break from it.

I don't like dogs full on jumping all over me so can quite understand that some doggy senior ladies don't either! In fact when I've had big dogs - stopping them from jumping up at people was one of my main concerns from early on when training. Even if some people 'don't mind it' there might come the day when it will be a child or an adult who is terrified of dogs who is on the receiving end of a full on jumping up at them.

In Newlyn a very elderly frail neighbour was flattened by the lady next door's big black lurcher. Not a nasty dog but not well controlled either. The old lady was hospitalised with a crack to her elbow and bruises all over where she landed on the concrete path. 'He is just pleased to see you' didn't quite cut it on that occasion.

I don't go for all this 'alpha male' stuff myself - no experience of it and didn't even know much about it until I read quite a lot of stuff discounting it.
I'm looking for another crate now as he's got so big he has o duck when he sits up. I would just like to use our baby gates instead but he just jumps them!

Tonks was, until last year, always put back on lead if we saw children or frail looking people because she'd always want to say hello. Seems not everyone has hear of the Staffie head butt greeting! Every time people ask if they can say hello to them I always warn them not to bend down too far!
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Lucky Star
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28-05-2013, 03:06 PM
Aw, that's so sweet. What a photo opportunity too!
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Darcy Boy
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28-05-2013, 05:33 PM
They look so gorgeous together.
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catrinsparkles
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28-05-2013, 06:35 PM
Thank you.
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Jo_McLoughlin
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28-05-2013, 07:34 PM
aww they are soo cute, I would love to get a playmate for my lil staffy, but I'm not sure that he would like not getting all the attention as currently he barks at us when we stroke or play with another dog as if to say what about me!
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