Exactly. Dogs in rescue are there because they were no longer wanted, for whatever reason. Get rid of rescues and we will end up with a similar situation to that in Ireland, where the pounds are full up and euthanasing thousands of dogs every year. That doesn't stop people from dumping/delivering to the pound/allowing them to escape without ID etc, etc, etc.

I have a hypothetical situation and a question for those of you who think MT (and other rescues) should not take PF ex breeders.

Imagine YOU are that person on the spot making that decision. YOU personally have the chance to save that dog; otherwise it’s a spade around the head and thrown onto a bonfire (possibly still alive).

What would you do?

People have questioned me for bringing dogs up from the US, they say that there are enough here needing homes, why would I bring in dogs from other countries? Because there is a MUCH bigger problem in the US, besides, not many deaf dogs here, that I can find.

I think rescuing is important, and it doesn't matter where they come from, they all need rescued.

Zoe is a puppy mill breeder dog. Is it wrong that we took her in and gave her a happy life? No it's not. She needed us. I have since heard romours that the "rescue" that she came from is a front for a puppy mill, they get rid of unsold puppies and unwanted breeders through this "rescue." I dont know if it's true, but there is a high probability that it is. Would I adopt from them again? Yes, if the dog needed me.

One can be a dog lover , AND except FACTS, because someone has a different opinion than others, it does not make them uncaring or less of a dog lover.

Do ALL dogs deserve a happy life, of cause they do,

Do ALL gets get a happy life, no they don`t, that`s simply a fact ,

Don't understand---all dogs deserve a happy life and many don't get one. We all know that.

What you seem to be saying is that because a dog is from a PF it as an individual doen't deserve the chance of a better life.

Have I got that right?

rune

I don't surmise that from Jackbox's post at all.

The facts are, there are more homeless dogs than there are good homes. So there is plenty of room to be slightly selective about where to source a dog. Some feel that rescues/owners should refuse to "help" a puppy farm by taking on PF dogs, and instead help a poundie instead.
In a practical POV it would be more than possible for rescues to avoid PFs and still have more dogs than there are homes for.
From an emotional POV, it is much tougher to draw that line. All dogs are just as deserving as each other.
No one's once said that PF dogs don't deserve a home as much as the next dog - but the fact is, taking a PF dog could be conceived as supporting a PF by making it easier for them to get rid of "old stock".
Jackbox just seems to be saying that just because a dog deserves a home, doesn't mean it will get that happy ending. There just physically aren't enough homes to give every dog what it deserves.

OK---so Jackbox---and others feel that the PF dogs DESERVE a good home but shouldn't get one because they happen to have ended up in a crap place to start with and that no rescue should be taking them on?

You really can't be on the fence here---at least Azz eventually came out and said he didn't think they should have the chance.

rune

I can be on the fence when it's not me having to make that decision. I can see pros and cons to each side of the argument, but don't have to make the final call because a) I'm not involved in rescuing dogs, b) I'm not making any financial donation to MT or any other rescues that deal with PFs and c) I'm not looking to adopt from MT or any other rescues that deal with puppy farms at the moment. If I was to do any of the above, I might consider my stance on the situation a bit more to decide whether I'm happy to support it or not, but until then, I feel it's in the same camp as all the other issues - adopting from or getting involved with a rescue that brings in dogs from abroad, one that turns away Staffies, one that euthanises young, healthy dogs, etc.
I don't feel strongly against any of these policies that I have to go and speak out against them on various forums, groups, etc. but equally I'd have to ask myself if I wanted to personally support them if I was to approach a rescue in the future.

Nope!! where do I say that

Exactly!

All dogs deserve to have a good life, those that come from breeders/good and bad, those that come from rescues AND those that come from PF, but the facts are there is never going to be enough good homes for all of them.

There is an argument that by taking surplus from PF, you are in a way supporting them.

I can see why this argument is raised, does not mean I feel one why or the other on it, simply just voicing the argument, it valid and factual.... you take their dogs, they bring in others to carry on the vile practice.

I know the other side of the argument also hold clout, and even with the few that are rescued from PF, others will suffer a terrible fate, "you cant save them all so we can save a few", I understand that argument too, but it still does not take away the facts, in a small way by taking their dogs , you are helping them.