Fear Aggression?

We've had a lot of problems lately with Storm and his aggression with some dogs while on lead. Lately though, he seems to be getting worse. Today, he was off lead and there was a large Malamute on lead and the owners said it was ok for their dog and Storm to meet. So, Storm and the Malamute (still on lead) started sniffing and all the while Storm's hackles were up, then the owners pulled away as they wanted to walk on and I called Storm, but he wouldn't leave the Malamute alone. So, I took hold of Storm's collar and tried to pull him away and then he started growling and barking at the Malamute and a fight would have probably broken out if I hadn't have pulled him away. He was just acting so aggressively to the poor Malamute, who was doing nothing!! We put Storm back on the lead then and the people with the Malamute carried on walking down the hill and Storm was barking like mad at the dog and sort of hiding behind my partner's legs at the same time, then pulling towards it too.

Then we were walking back along the main road and a man with a dog Storm's size and who Storm had played with in the past, was walking behind us on the pavement and Storm has stopped for a drink (as nice people leave bowls of water outside their houses along that pavement) and the man and dog were getting closer, and as they went to pass us, Storm lunged, growling and barking towards the dog, even though the dog was just walking past and hardly paying Storm any notice! I think it even looked like Storm was trying to grab the dog by the back of the neck, though I'm not entirely sure.

Today also, we walked past a dog (again same size as Storm) who was tied up to a lamp post and Storm was pulling to try and get to it, then when the dog reacted a little, Storm went crazy again and even though he had his harness on, I couldn't control him.

It really seems that for some reason Storm just doesn't like some dogs and up until today it's always only when he's on lead. But when he kicked off at the Malamute, Storm was off lead!

Do you think this sounds like fear aggression, as it's always with dogs who are the same size as him or bigger? We just think it's a bit strange that the dogs he lunges at are usually just minding their own business and don't seem to be a threat (have watched their body language) to Storm at all.

Can you get someone in?? Prob best to have someone who can actually SEE what is going on

Does sound a little like Mia there
If everything is calm and slow for her to asses the dog then all is fine

If the OTHER dog is on the lead that can cause problems - especially if the owner is making the dog move away - or march right up to us
All I can think is the lead is making the other dog have to act in an unatural way - especially if the dog is being made to walk straight up to us to pass us on a narrow path - this is v rude for dogs


Sounds like things really only started kicking off when the humans tried to interfear in the greeting

Might be an idea to teach a 'ok' type command where when things are still calm you call his attention back to you to get a reward - so he can greet, but then focus on you - so the other dog becomes less important

The kicking off at the tied up dog - who barked at him
well understandable - try giving a wider birth in those situations, reward lots and encourage a 'look at me' command to just really try and ignore dogs like that - no need for him to worry about tied up dogs


The dog coming up behind could well have startled him, and if he was feeling a bit insecure then its understandable - also could have been resource guarding of the water bowl

another good command to have is 'lets go' or 'this way' where when you get in a situation you are worried about you can just turn around and get away - legit if needed

I teach a 'this way' simply when walking - when the dogs are infront on a path and the path splits I go the opposite way from the dogs and say 'this way' and they soon learn they better pay attention cos Im leaving
I also teach it on lead turning sharply and giving them a treat when they turn
Pretty soon I can say 'this way' and turn and run the other way and they whip round and race after me

I hope you can get things under control, I know how stressful walks can be when you are on edge all the time

- also - from Wilbars fantastic advice - its a really good idea to give him a week or so without having to react at anything - just keep him totaly away from anything that you think might stress him

I agree. Do what I'm having to do now, try and take hiim in less dog populated areas, because as a behaviourist has told me, if iit IS fear aggression, it is only going to escalate by constantly being stressed seeing all these dogs and not knowing how to deal with the stress levels of it.

Since I've been meeting up with the "odd" dog here and there, my dog has been a different dog, totally relaxed and friendly, whereas when I was meeting lots of dogs on a daily basis, she was getting into punch ups with some of them, and at the end of the day, who actually KNOWS what starts it all off. Maybe they don't like their colour, maybe they don't like their attitude, maybe they want to dominate, you just don't KNOW unless you speak dog which none of us do!

I'd hate for you to witness what I have when my dog bit another dog, plus the cost to your wallet, so be careful is my advice, and be sensible about this now that you've seen the sudden change in Storm. I will tell you one thing, no matter HOW obedient your dog is (and mine certainly is!) it certainly won't stop fighting to come back to you just because you asked it! That's a fact!

If you CAN, get out into some more isolated places, and be very aware of how your dog is behaving now and act accordingly like I'm having to do. If you can't afford a good behaviourist they are more than willing to have a good chat over the phone with you, and it helped me tremendously, even though I haven't actually seen my one yet. Good luck.

Oh yup totaly I forgot to add - all the commands are for when he is still pretty calm
When things are kicking off its not likely he is even going to hear you let alone obay
If you feel things might not go well just get out of there before they even happen

You sound like you are having the same problem with Storm as i'm having with Flynn. His reactions are worse if I take him by the collar or if he's on lead and again, it seems to be more aimed at dogs of similar or larger size. He also doesnt like dogs who approach in an excited way, he's perfectly ok with calm dogs.

I try and avoid other dogs as much as I can but you're always going to meet them. I met a lady today who had 3 frantic dogs all barking and behaving like lunatics. I knew Flynn wouldnt react favourably so I took him by the collar and told this lady he wasnt too friendly. Her advice?..."just let him off, he'll be ok". I explained that i'd rather other dogs didnt approach him in such a manner so that he wouldnt have to react but she did absolutely nothing to stop her dogs harassing mine and just repeated her advice again! This was from a lady i'd just witnessed be pulled onto her back by her dogs as she struggled to hold onto them!

I just try and assess the other dog. If it's a young one who comes running over wanting to play I know that will spark Flynn off so I try and remove him before he reacts too badly. Fortunately I have 2 other dogs to deflect unwanted attention away from him. If the other dog is calm and has good canine manners I dont do anything as I know he'll be ok.

yes Ben is a godsend in my case - if a dog comes running up - or a rude owner is determined to charge up - I send Ben off to see them
This gives Mia time to approach in her own time and asses the situation - and the other dog saying hello to Ben is much more natural body language

and no dogs growl at Ben, he has the magic touch

Holding onto the collar and pulling will give the exact same reaction as to being on lead. He is reacting when he is confined, there are lots of post on here and other places on the web about how when a dog is being restrained by its collar/harness/headcollar or anything else it effects it's body posture, it can feel threatened and cornered. The flight from fight or flight is removed, therefore only leaving the fight option. In this way I think you can see some positive, he is not in that way getting worse. And the point that while he is free he is okish around other dogs gives you something to work with.

I do think it is very important that you find a positive behaviourist who will help you desensitise Storm to other dogs. This can be accomplished well with a clicker, time, patience, and space. Not to mention another patient dog who will stay put, not react, and may even face away and be less intimidating. But again a decent behaviourist/trainer would be essential and very very helpful.
Any mention of check chains, throwing chains at the floor, pushing/pulling the dog around/into positions and run run run away and save your poor dog from being frightened and confused!

Thanks for all the replies.

Will take on board what everybody has said. I cannot afford a trainer at the moment though, so will need to work through it on my own.

As for not walking Storm where other dogs are, that's quite difficult around here, as everywhere we go there are dogs. We live in the countryside and also near to Glastonbury Tor, so there are nearly always tonnes of people walking around with dogs where ever we go.

Shamus acts like this and it`s simply that he`s nervous - he can get into a bit of a state with other dogs.
I`ve worked on recalling him when I see him stiffen and he comes and stands beside me and that`s his safe place.
Try more work on recall, and then take him away from the other dog or get between him and the other dog so he feels safe?

Today we met two dogs on separate occasions and Storm and the other dogs were on lead.

The first dog was coming towards us and Storm did his usual ears up, staring and pulling towards the dog. The dog looked really friendly, so we let him go towards the dog to meet it, but the owners were in too much of a hurry and didn't want their dog to meet Storm. So as we pulled Storm away and the owners walked on, Storm kicked off.

The second time, the owner let his dog and Storm greet each other and everything was fine for a couple of minutes, while they were sniffing each other, until we pulled away to walk on and then Storm kicked off again.

It seems to me now that he doesn't suffer from fear aggression, but more from frustration at either not being able to meet properly. Or being allowed to meet, wanting to play and then being pulled away and it's like he's sort of having a trantrum because he can't do what he wants?

Does it sound like that could be the case?