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Teejanddeej
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Location: Hampshire, UK
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03-12-2012, 09:28 PM

Rescue Dog .is this agresssion..

Hi everyone,

I've just joined the forum, I'm hoping to get some advice about a rescue dog I've recently rehomed. She's a lab/cross apparently but she looks pure lab to me. She was due to be put down as she doesn't like other dogs and has arthritis. I no longer have a dog since losing my beloved Lab TJ 4 years ago but I'm a dog walker so still have a lot of contact with dogs.
Initially I said I would keep her for a few days to give the rspca time to find her a forever home. But I've fallen in love with her!
The problem is that as I'm a dog walker the fact that she doesn't like other dogs is a big problem, plus who would have her when we go on holiday. Apparently at the last home she was at she attacked a dog which subsequently had to have 7 stitches.
Well since she's been with me (2 weeks) she has been for 2 walks a day (they told me she didn't like going for walks!) had no signs of stiffness (they said she could sometimes not get off her bed in the morning) and been basically the perfect dog indoors.
I have taken her for walks where we see other dogs and when she sees them she lays down (in a pouncing position?) She doesn't have her hackles up and just seems to be watching the other dog. As yet only 1 dog has approached her and she rolled slightly to her side and then growled slightly. The other dog then just walked away.
I met up with my friend who has a very placid lab and after the initial laying down she did walk with him and eventually ended up walking next to him.
I'm now wondering whether she's aggressive or just scared of other dogs and if she's scared what can I do to help the situation?
Any advice would be welcome.
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Meg
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04-12-2012, 08:55 AM
Hello Debbie and welcome
At a guess I would say your new dog hasn't been socialised and is fearful of other dogs.

I would try to find a place where other dogs can be viewed at a safe distance by your dog. Go armed with treats and a favourite toy to get her attention and reward her for ignoring them so that she grows to feel comfortable with them being around.

It may also help to teach 'watch me' which can be used to get and keep your dogs attention . This is how I do it..
.. take a high value treat like chicken and give it to the dog so it knows what is on offer . Now take a treat and hold in front of your eyes and ask your dog to 'watch me' and her gaze should fix on the treat.
Keep saying 'good girl' as she watches the treat but not too excitedly (you want calm focus from the dog not excitement ), then after a moment give the treat and praise.
Extend the 'watch me' time and see how long you can hold the dogs gaze lowering your voice to a whisper saying 'good girl' all the time you have her attention.
Each time her eyes leave yours make a sound 'ahah' then go back to saying 'watch me, good girl' when she returns your gaze, now treat and praise.
Do this a number of times each day starting in a quiet place where there are no distractions (eg in the house)and progress to a place with distractions (eg the garden). Eventually you should get her attention for long periods and you can use this 'tool' to get your dog's attention in a variety of circumstances .

There is an article here about 'Desensitizing shy or nervous dogs' which may be of help

Desensitizing shy or nervous dogs

I would see how it goes, it is early days yet and I would watch for and note any signs of agression.
If it is an aggression problem I think you may need the help of a good behaviourist, you vet should be able to refer you to one.
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Jenny
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04-12-2012, 12:13 PM
It sounds to me like fear aggression.

One of my dogs who was extremely well socialised and had no problems with other dogs was attacked by another dog (an off-lead dog and mine was on lead) when he was 10 months old. He was then very fearful of other dogs approaching him and it has taken me months and months to start to get his confidence back. We have had no problems with him but to start with he would either lie down or 'bow' whenever another dog approached and then give a low growl.
Fortunately that rarely happens now, but my dog's behaviour was definitely due to fear and not because he is an aggressive dog. I spent months walking with known dogs and using 'watch me' command when another dog was near and I could sense him tensing up. It worked!!
Hopefully walking with other friendly dogs etc will boost his confidence.

It is always possible that the vet/rescue were told that he had arthritis by his previous owner as it made them feel less guilty of having him PTS

Good luck and I hope you can sort him out.
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zoe1969
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04-12-2012, 12:16 PM
Sounds like fear aggression to me too. She behaves like my lurcher Jenny used to. I think Mini's advice is very good and I did a similar thing with Jenny and now she's excellent when out and quite sociable.
Good for you for keeping her and I wish you the very best of luck with her. I think she'll be ok if she can already walk past dogs without attacking them xxxx
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Rosebud77
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04-12-2012, 12:42 PM
Same with collie here. As these two are very much my guard dogs and as they never meet other dogs and rarely people I leave them as they are.
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Teejanddeej
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05-12-2012, 10:10 PM
Thanks everyone for your replies. The watch me command sounds like a very good idea. I am going to start tomorrow at home with some very smelly sausage! I will let you know how it goes.
I spoke to the RSPCA lady today and she said she definitely has arthritis in her spine and back legs, she has seen the x rays. She's on metacam and takes cod liver oil tablets and glucosamine so I guess they must be working.
xx
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Meg
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05-12-2012, 11:28 PM
Originally Posted by Teejanddeej View Post
Thanks everyone for your replies. The watch me command sounds like a very good idea. I am going to start tomorrow at home with some very smelly sausage! I will let you know how it goes.
I spoke to the RSPCA lady today and she said she definitely has arthritis in her spine and back legs, she has seen the x rays. She's on metacam and takes cod liver oil tablets and glucosamine so I guess they must be working.
xx
Hi Debbie if she is in pain the need to protect herself could contribute to making her wary of other dogs.

Good luck , let us know how you are getting on and well done for giving this poor girl a chance
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Teejanddeej
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06-12-2012, 11:28 AM
Hi, feeling a bit deflated this morning. Took Lucy for a walk and all was going well until we heard lots of yapping and turned round to see 2 yorkshire terriers heading towards us. As I didn't see them coming I didn't have time to get Lucy looking at me. She laid down and wouldn't move so I couldn't cross to the other side of the road and the other lady just kept coming! Then Lucy leapt forwards and was growling (it all happened quickly so its a bit of a blur) but I managed to keep hold of her. The other lady said "perhaps she wants to say hello" to which I replied "no, she doesn't want to say hello!" so she kept walking. But Lucy was going mad trying to get to them I had to hold her by the collar otherwise she would have reached them and she seemed to be trying to wriggle out of her collar. I was really worried for a moment that she would escape and I think she would have harmed them if she had got to them. Afterwards I managed to calm her down with the watch me command but she was agitated for the rest of the walk.
How should I react when something like this happens? I don't know whether to tell her off or try and soothe her. I don't want to do the wrong thing but I felt out of control today.
Usually in the morning we just go for a walk around our estate so I don't put a muzzle on her and most of the dogs we see are at a distance so she just lays down and looks at them until they pass. I have sometimes taken the muzzle with me but after today I realise I wouldn't have had time to put it on her anyway.
I'm wondering now whether the aggression can ever be dealt with/controlled which upsets me because I want to keep her but can't if she remains aggressive with other dogs. As I said before I'm a dog walker and as she can't be walked with other dogs I'm walking her separately twice a day which means I'm currently doing 6 walks a day!
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Kaska
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06-12-2012, 11:38 AM
Same good advice from Minihaha, but I'd just like to add I have a nearly 4yr old bitch whom I've had from a puppy, and who just does not like other dogs. She's never been attacked, she lives with five other dogs who she is fine with and even bullies them - but strange dogs she cannot tolerate through fear, it's just in her nature.

I took her puppy training - she spent the whole of the first lesson hiding under my chair or behind my legs which was a huge surprise to me as she had settled in with my dogs no problem! I walked her round town, took her to a very busy county show, did everything I could think of to socialise her, but she has never got out of her dislike of other dogs. She is very tuned into me but there is nothing I could tempt her with (toy/food) that would distract her if a dog approached, I've tried!

I manage it to the point where if I spot another dog I will put her lead on. She will be fine unless the other dog forces itself on her whereupon she will snap. If she's not on the lead she will run a mile! In her case it's fear aggression but it only manifests itself if she's cornered or feels she can't get away. Her recall is excellent and she doesn't seek out the other dogs she would just rather not have any approach her!
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Kaska
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06-12-2012, 11:48 AM
In reply to your post I think that she will need a lot of time and attention to work on this behaviour which could be a big problem for you with your dog walking, as you say you have to work her separately. It's not an easy one and even with your best attempts she may not become as reliable as you'd want her to be. Punishing her wouldn't have any effect I don't think and might only serve to make things worse. Distraction is the best thing IF you can find something that works! To be fair to her you haven't had her that long and she may come round - but I think you need to decide whether you are able to put in the effort required which may or may not end up with a satisfactory result - it's a shame as you have become attached to her, and a pity your other activities involve other dogs!

I think if it was me and I really wanted to keep her, I'd muzzle her in public for the time being.

Sorry not to be of any real help!
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